Physical Changes

[tarantulaman1000]

When I look at the voting page, there are suggestions that are beating mine that actually suggest that hypnosis can cause any substantial physical change. It can make you hallucinate, it can change behavior, it is a fantastic, powerful and interesting tool, but it can not alter one's physical body. I mean honestly people, get serious, hypnosis is cool, but you can't turn into a bloody animal, or a woman, or a hatstand.

[Jack]

If I'm not mistaken, most of those files are for changing self-perception, rather than actual, physical transmutation. However, I believe I've posted on this subject before.. run a search of the forums for "dna" since I am unwilling to go through the rigamarole a second time.

[loony28]

:twisted: Physical transformation is indeed posible. I've heard of cases of people with multiple personality disorder having some physical changes when one personality takes over. Our minds are powerful and can affect the physical body in drastic ways if you can get rid of the programming that says the physical body can not be changed. :twisted:

[loadedkaos]

What about people being hypnotized to blead or get rashes in patterns. The subconscious regulates alot of physical changes. People can develop muscle strength from it. Erickson overcame his polio with the power of his subconscious. Just because most professionals haven't gone further down the subconscious mind and the effects it has on actual physical changes doesn't mean it can't happen. Although I understand the skeptacism, I agree that some of the physical transformations on the voting page have gotten a little out of hand. But I think it would be interesting to find out from the individuals who were willing to test this to it's limits.

[Kobold]

But I think it would be interesting to find out from the individuals who were willing to test this to it's limits.

Give me a good FoxTailAndEars-File and I might be willing to find out what happens

[Brainiac]

I've read a couple reports where people with multiple personalities had diabetes in one personality and not in another. They also have changes so far as eye colour and even odour differences. Another guy I met at a party once could will moles to appear and disappear on his skin, it took about a minute for the process to work either way. Let's also not forget that mental trauma can cause hair colour changes.

[loony28]

:twisted: All these things would lead one to at least think that the body isn't as stable as you've been taught. How far can the physical transformations go? I'm willing to bet that it can go so far that your body would become unrecognizable. Like maybe change into mist like some vampire lore or into a were-animal like werewolves. I'm one that is willing to test physical transformation to it's limits though I don't think there are limits. Maybe I'll submit a shapeshifting file idea on the vote page. :twisted:

:twisted: P.S. I have a poll up here http://www.warpmymind.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=311. It's a poll asking if you believe or think that physical transformation is possible and how far it can go. :twisted:

[Sesshy70]

i fullyagree with loony 28

[demigraff]

I've read a couple reports where people with multiple personalities had diabetes in one personality and not in another.

Like me :)

[VeryGnawty]

It can make you hallucinate, it can change behavior, it is a fantastic, powerful and interesting tool, but it can not alter one's physical body.

I beg to differ. I've been using a form of self-hypnosis for quite some time. I have achieved some amount of feminization. Also, I've completely killed my sex drive, if you consider that to be a physical thing (which it arguably is).

But there are limitations. Biological systems don't seem to like to change. Sure, a small change like body odor is no problem. But if you wanted to, say, turn yourself into a dragon, such a task would take so much time and resources that you would probably die of old age long before you saw any physical progress.

By the way, if I actually had the willpower for such an endeavor, I would try it. Not that anyone hasn't guessed that already based on my avatar.

[TabbyCat]

Also, I've completely killed my sex drive, if you consider that to be a physical thing (which it arguably is).

Depression isn't physical yet it has the same effects, so arguably it isn't.

[VeryGnawty]

Depression isn't physical yet it has the same effects, so arguably it isn't.

Point taken.

But on a related note, depression can have physical side effects...

[tarantulaman1000]

So what if depression can have phyiscal side effects? Has it for you? I haven't been able to see any convincing before and after pictures, so as far as I'm concerned, turning into mist or a wolf is entirely impossible based on a bevy of reasons (I'll give you enough credit to guess what they are).

[Jack]

I refuse your credit. What are your bevy of reasons, exactly?

[VeryGnawty]

I haven't been able to see any convincing before and after pictures, so as far as I'm concerned, turning into mist or a wolf is entirely impossible based on a bevy of reasons (I'll give you enough credit to guess what they are).

I haven't seen Jesus, but I believe he existed.

[loony28]

I haven't been able to see any convincing before and after pictures, so as far as I'm concerned, turning into mist or a wolf is entirely impossible based on a bevy of reasons (I'll give you enough credit to guess what they are).

I haven't seen Jesus, but I believe he existed.

:twisted: Excellent point VeryGnawty. Just because you haven't seen the proof doesn't mean it isn't possible. If we all required proof of something being possible, we wouldn't have made it out of the stone age. Think about what we have today and then think about what would of happened if someone didn't think it was possible to do without first seeing the proof that it was possible. :twisted:

[tarantulaman1000]

Terrible point VeryGnawty, I haven't seen Jesus either, but there's solid evidence that he existed that I've seen, not necessarily as the son of God, but he existed. I haven't seen Bhutan but I believe it exists because I've seen a bloody atlas. I haven't seen a unicorn and I don't expect to because no credible sources confirm the existence of unicorn.

[TabbyCat]

Well answered; my usual response involves the tooth-fairy ^^;

[Jack]

What do your consider solid evidence?

And I reiterate: I refuse your credit. What are your bevy of reasons, exactly?

[sandy82]

As much as I might be tempted, I am not going to involve myself in a debate over whether a man can turn himself into a wolf or a mist. I just hope the guy buys a roundtrip ticket before he sets out on such a journey.

I did have a sense of deja vu when I read some of the arguments pro and con. The reason is that this debate had died...until it was revived after nearly a month.

I make a prediction: the argument eventually will revolve around burden of proof, rules of evidence, and definitions of words and concepts. IOW, the substance of the disagreement won't be addressed nearly so much as the etiquette of debate itself. Sooner or later, the debate is likely to veer toward ad hominem attacks.

Nobody wins. And, in the end, who cares? The discussion is not taking place before the Rockefeller or Ford Foundation's committee on research grants.

What is the point of enlightening the opponent? Why make the effort, in the absence of stakes, to provide a free educaion?

My view. Congratulate the other side on its keen perception and accurate logic...and leave them (from your own perspective) in the abysmal ignorance they so richly deserve.

Note that I have not taken sides in the debate. I will offer an opinion on a single individual in the debate. Jack is highly knowledgeable and a skillful debater. If I were arguing that things fall down (or up), I would want him on my team.

[Jack]

Good point. Anyone who is interested in the points I've made in the past dealing with this issue: click on the profile button at the bottom of this posting, and read through my previous posts. I'm sure you'll find it interesting, perhaps enlightening, and logical.

*exits stage left*

[tarantulaman1000]

Copied directly from the Feminization Forum, where a similar debate is going on, I make a case for what you stand to gain by convincing me or anyone: Loadedkaos, you're somewhat correct, but you have a lot to gain by convincing people that your faith is correct. When you have a certain critical mass, your faith moves into the mainstream, keeping people from thinking of you as wackos. Right now, you're a cult, nobody respects a cult. You have a lot to gain when you can safely say, I believe in magic, a great amount is gained for you. The reason Catholics can say they're Catholic is because they have the critcal mass, you don't, so if you gain credibilty from one person at a time, eventually being a witch will be normal and accepted.