Eye Color

[Defunct]

I was wondering about this. Would it be possible to change your eye color through hypnosis? I'd think based on some of the other changes that seem possible through hypnosis, changing melanin levels or something would be relatively easy. Then again, I don't know.

Also would be interesting if you could change your skin tone too.

[Blink]

There's already a long thread discussing what might and might not be possible using hypnosis: "Aren't These Impossible?"

I'd suggest reading that, even though I don't think there was a response specifically to your question. You'll still get an idea of where the opinions fall.

-- Blink

[CuriousG]

A good rule of thumb is: If a drug can't do it, hypnosis can't either.

That's not to say this rule is absolute, nor for that matter that hypnosis can do everything pills can.

[Jack]

Nor that pills can do everything hypnosis can.

[CuriousG]

Nor that pills can do everything hypnosis can.

Well, of course, that's why I said it doesn't apply all the time.

However, most of the things that hypnosis can do that pills can't have nothing to do with physiology (unless you can think of a counter-example?).

[Jack]

limited forms of catatonia(including partial limb/extremities, and dissociation[also induces extreme anesthesia])

any form of color-blindness, and any level of blindness(although there are some drugs that in some people do induce various levels of temporary blindness)

hmmm, there are others, but they don't induce what I would consider physiological phenomenon.

any kinesthetic sensations including sharp, hot, cold, wet, dry, slimy, etc.

As you're aware, there are other phenomenon which both hypnosis, and pills do very well: inducing/reducing erections, increased/decreased need to eliminate bowels/bladder, speed of heart beating, hallucinations, etc

For a lot of these effects, pills can be the easier choice depending on the patient(IQ, preconditioning, ease of administration, etc) and doctor(timing, training, etc).

[Lissar]

I'm pretty sure that you cannot change your eye color through hypnosis. Eye color is based on multiple genes, and you cannot change your DNA.

[Jack]

Yup, and Lissar wasn't convinced. Hence the "I'm pretty sure". Better than(ifI remember correctly) his original "This won't work!"(pretty sure that's a paraphrase of his attitude, rather than a direct quote)

[goldragon_70]

I'm pretty sure that you cannot change your eye color through hypnosis. Eye color is based on multiple genes, and you cannot change your DNA.

Actually DNA makes RNA which in turn causes the manufacture of the different parts of the body, so there are several places were that can be changed to cause change in the human body.

You also have cases were hair color, and even eye color have changed over a persons ageing.

[CuriousG]

Contacts are an easier and better-established way to change eyecolor than hypnosis. Frankly, I doubt that hypnosis even can change eyecolor, but then Ol' Birch will hit me with that breast site, so I won't. I'll just stick to my first sentence, which is indisputable fact. Also, bear in mind that just because something can happen due to effects such as aging doesn't mean it can happen with conscious control. You're no more in total control of your body than a CEO is in total control of Joe Janitor.

Here are a couple of links:
[url]http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a971205.html[/url]
[url]http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/feb2002/1013052193.Me.r.html[/url]

[loony28]

:twisted: Well I have heard that with some people with multiple personalities that when one personality takes over the eye color of the person can change. I have seen my own eyes start to change from green to yellow at times. So yes, hypnosis can change your eye color and I would think your skin color to. :twisted:

[Lissar]

I'm pretty sure that you cannot change your eye color through hypnosis. Eye color is based on multiple genes, and you cannot change your DNA.

Actually DNA makes RNA which in turn causes the manufacture of the different parts of the body, so there are several places were that can be changed to cause change in the human body.

You also have cases were hair color, and even eye color have changed over a persons ageing.

DNA does not "make" RNA. DNA is simply a blueprint which cannot be changed. RNA is able to make a copy of that data and bring it to ribosomes, where polypeptides are produced. In eukaryotic cells (human cells are eukaryotic), certain parts of the messenger RNA are excised so that many polypeptids can be made with the same stretch of DNA. Even though this occurs, it occurs according to the DNA. Everything is up to those instructions.

Eye color is determined by DNA, which does not change, and therefore the RNA isn't going to suddenly create a polypeptide that codes for something else. My eyes are sometimes blue and sometimes green, and you know what? It all depends on what color shirt or eyeshadow I'm wearing. So my eye color doesn't change; it's already in between two colors, and so in comparison to blue, it seems green, and in comparison to green, it seems blue.

And you keep misspelling the word "where." "Were" is a verb, as in, "We were stubbornly refusing to accept that Lissar might know a thing or two about basic genetics."

[Jack]

Lissar, what's cancer?

[goldragon_70]

DNA does not "make" RNA. DNA is simply a blueprint which cannot be changed. RNA is able to make a copy of that data and bring it to ribosomes, where polypeptides are produced. In eukaryotic cells (human cells are eukaryotic), certain parts of the messenger RNA are excised so that many polypeptids can be made with the same stretch of DNA. Even though this occurs, it occurs according to the DNA. Everything is up to those instructions.

Eye color is determined by DNA, which does not change, and therefore the RNA isn't going to suddenly create a polypeptide that codes for something else. My eyes are sometimes blue and sometimes green, and you know what? It all depends on what color shirt or eyeshadow I'm wearing. So my eye color doesn't change; it's already in between two colors, and so in comparison to blue, it seems green, and in comparison to green, it seems blue.

And you keep misspelling the word "where." "Were" is a verb, as in, "We were stubbornly refusing to accept that Lissar might know a thing or two about basic genetics."

RNA does not always directly construct pats of the body, but can effects the body to make parts of itself, so even after the RNA, there are places for change. RNA can also be effect in gene therapy (even though for a short time) Viruses effect DNA (rarely to a good end), and Cancer is a reflection of changes in the cell, including DNA. And yes if DNA can be changed so can RNA.

[Lissar]

Cancer is a mutation, a mistake. 50% of the time, it is caused by a problem with p53, which normally finds mutations and has them corrected. Most cases of cervical cancer are caused by a virus that attacks the cervical cells and inserts its own parasitic genetic information.

I would really appreciate it if people would consider the difference between cancer and changing eye color. Cancer is a terrible and serious disease, and it is characterized by mutations that affect the reproductive rate of cells. If we knew how mutations occurred, and we were able to control that, cancer would not be an issue. So if hypnosis could change DNA, maybe my best friend would still have her thyroid gland, my classmate wouldn't have missed a year of school, and my grandfather would still be alive.

If you want to go and argue about how evolutionary change could not have occurred without mutations, you're forgetting that individuals do not change phenotypically, only genotypically, and that genotypic change must occur in the cells that become gametes. That's why cancer is not passed down (although you can have a genetic predisposition); it usually occurs in somatic cells. So the first child to have DNA that coded for blue eyes did not have parents whose eye colors changed from another color to blue.

goldragon_70, I have absolutely no idea what you're even saying. If you read my previous post, you may have seen that I was talking about polypeptides as the end product of transcription and translation.

[CuriousG]

RNA does not always directly construct pats of the body, but can effects the body to make parts of itself, so even after the RNA, there are places for change. RNA can also be effect in gene therapy (even though for a short time) Viruses effect DNA (rarely to a good end), and Cancer is a reflection of changes in the cell, including DNA. And yes if DNA can be changed so can RNA.

A wrecking ball can change the shape of a building, but it can't build my house.

[goldragon_70]

Cancer is a mutation, a mistake. 50% of the time, it is caused by a problem with p53, which normally finds mutations and has them corrected. Most cases of cervical cancer are caused by a virus that attacks the cervical cells and inserts its own parasitic genetic information.

I would really appreciate it if people would consider the difference between cancer and changing eye color. Cancer is a terrible and serious disease, and it is characterized by mutations that affect the reproductive rate of cells. If we knew how mutations occurred, and we were able to control that, cancer would not be an issue. So if hypnosis could change DNA, maybe my best friend would still have her thyroid gland, my classmate wouldn't have missed a year of school, and my grandfather would still be alive.

Actualy there are the few cases that people have been able to stop cancer with meditation.

If you want to go and argue about how evolutionary change could not have occurred without mutations, you're forgetting that individuals do not change phenotypically, only genotypically, and that genotypic change must occur in the cells that become gametes. That's why cancer is not passed down (although you can have a genetic predisposition); it usually occurs in somatic cells. So the first child to have DNA that coded for blue eyes did not have parents whose eye colors changed from another color to blue.

goldragon_70, I have absolutely no idea what you're even saying. If you read my previous post, you may have seen that I was talking about polypeptides as the end product of transcription and translation.

And yet there is cancer that is caused geneticaly, could be that evolution? And that genetic predisposition had to be strated some were. Besides many genetic abnormailties have been classified as cancer, and some evolutional changes would be considered a cancer if clasified at the time they started to develop (All though more are seen in other animals, then humans).

[Lissar]

There's no way I can respond to your post, goldragon, because once again, it makes NO sense at all. Where are you even getting information to support your absurd argument?

[goldragon_70]

High school Human anatomy and physiology, and the meditation thing came from a friend of the person that did it.

[Lissar]

That's strange, considering I've just completed a year of college intro biology, and I had already taken intro and advanced biology in high school prior to that. Perhaps you aren't remembering your class correctly. Also, anatomy and physiology aren't genetics.

[Senji]

If magick can do it, hypnosis can do it.

[Blink]

To misquote John Gillespie Magee, Jr., "Oh, I have slipped the surly bonds of reason...."

-- Blink
blink-blink

[goldragon_70]

That's strange, considering I've just completed a year of college intro biology, and I had already taken intro and advanced biology in high school prior to that. Perhaps you aren't remembering your class correctly. Also, anatomy and physiology aren't genetics.

Right, but DNA and RNA is part of the study, as well as study on amino Acids and how they are used in building cells and chemicals the body uses. And it was covered in my older classes as well. Biology tends to be far more general in science then Human Anatomy and Physiology.

Actually Cancer usually cased by damaged (mutated) DNA, and this is usually part of the definition of cancer. (I know this was a few post ago, but the fact you didn't quite add it, has been bugging me.)

Any ways my original point before we got so far off. There is places were the construction of the body can be changed, and keeping a negative attitude on something will not get it done, weather it will happen or not.

Science itself seeks to explain phenomenons by observance, and then hypothesis are made, which are then tested, and if not diproven are then made theories, which can still be disproven. So nothing is solid fact, only proven until disproven.

[CuriousG]

That's strange, considering I've just completed a year of college intro biology, and I had already taken intro and advanced biology in high school prior to that. Perhaps you aren't remembering your class correctly. Also, anatomy and physiology aren't genetics.

Right, but DNA and RNA is part of the study, as well as study on amino Acids and how they are used in building cells and chemicals the body uses. And it was covered in my older classes as well. Biology tends to be far more general in science then Human Anatomy and Physiology.

Actually Cancer usually cased by damaged (mutated) DNA, and this is usually part of the definition of cancer. (I know this was a few post ago, but the fact you didn't quite add it, has been bugging me.)

Any ways my original point before we got so far off. There is places were the construction of the body can be changed, and keeping a negative attitude on something will not get it done, weather it will happen or not.

Science itself seeks to explain phenomenons by observance, and then hypothesis are made, which are then tested, and if not diproven are then made theories, which can still be disproven. So nothing is solid fact, only proven until disproven.

Statistical studies have shown that obscene overoptimism has less than a 0.5% chance of panning out... Of course, that's only proven until disproven.

[Jack]

Statistical studies have shown that obscene overoptimism has less than a 0.5% chance of panning out... Of course, that's only proven until disproven.

Have there been studies done on the chance of obscene overpessimism panning out?

[CuriousG]

People told the Wright Brothers that their machine would never fly, they laughed at Edison's idea of the light bulb. When Bell invented the telephone, people said it was a trick, that the wires were hollow and that carried the voice, because they didn't understand the forces at work. And Roger Bannister was told that no one would ever break the 4 minute mile. Even fitness experts, and coaches said that. If fact, I bet they could have found evidence in a text book to prove their point to him. Probably something about the oxygen uptake of the human body. Good thing he didn't listen to them.

Yamamoto warned the Japanese high command that the U.S. would whoop them, John Brown's contemporaries told him that his 'uprising' would forever be stigmatized as an act of crazy rebellion instead of being the catalyst to a widespread slave revolt, thousands of ambitious but untalented garage bands have been told that all their members are tone-deaf, the Army Corp of Engineers cautioned that the NO levees weren't fit to stand up to a large hurricane, Freud's friends told him that Cocaine was unhealthy and addicting, etc.

Good thing they didn't listen, eh?

The limits of hypnosis are constantly being probed by professional hypnotherapist, who actually have some sorts of qualification. If they haven't managed to create the radical changes that some people here ardently claim might be possible (in spite of not having experienced them), then what conceivable possibility is there that such things could possibly be done by the crudely recorded 20 minute files found on WMM?

[goldragon_70]

Statistical studies have shown that obscene overoptimism has less than a 0.5% chance of panning out... Of course, that's only proven until disproven.

Yet, there are many success stories that start out like that. Just look for any lucrative business opportunity, and the people who have made them work.

[Dingus]

Just out of curiosity, has anyone here actually tried to change they're eye or skin color via hypnosis? It sure would help as a form of proof, to which we could theorize about, rather then debate.

[Jack]

Do I hear a volunteer in the croud, Dingus?

[NeKofLiP]

i would happily volunteer. i didn't even read the debates, but in my opinion, if you really think it can happen, it will. unless its some BS like you being able to fly or something.

[goldragon_70]

If someone is willing to make the file, or do the sessions, I will do it. I have some green in my brown eyes, and I would like to see if I can my my eyes mostly green instead of mostly brown.

[NeKofLiP]

ah you are lucky. my eyes are a typical dark brown, i would love to have green eyes. why don't we make a file of this in the voting page?

[goldragon_70]

Could make one that works with you when you look at your eyes in the mirror. You look for the color in your eyes that you want and you focus on promoting the spread of the color.