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BobbyS wrote:As to whether hypnosis itself is a placebo effect, I would actually argue that it is since so much expectation of what the hypnosis will be like and how it will affect you CAN actually influence how the hypnosis pans out.
baby_jessica75 wrote:BobbyS wrote:As to whether hypnosis itself is a placebo effect, I would actually argue that it is since so much expectation of what the hypnosis will be like and how it will affect you CAN actually influence how the hypnosis pans out.
correct me if I'm wrong please but a placebo effect is something working only because the person thinks it will then the best we can expect in hypnosis is a placebo effect because that is what hypnosis is designed to do then is it fair to call it a placebo effect because it is doing its intended purpose to begin with? you'll have to excuse me I need to lay down I just confussed myself!
bdbu wrote:the reason it gets brought up so much here is because half the people never actually go into trance and just role play. a quick look at the "show me your..." photo galleries is more than enuff prove of that. but honestly there is a huge different between using binaural beats and true hypnosis. the effects of binaural beats on the brain are purely hypothetical and made up by hippies who think waking life is a good movie and kid a is an awesome album.
bdbu wrote:i thought this was in response to me thats why i clarified that binaurals and hypnosis are way different. and i mention role players because thats what generates so many skeptics.
bdbu wrote:the problem with binaurals is the science behind them suggests that it should work the same for everyone. i mean a theta wave is a theta wave and a sine wave is a sine wave there isnt any variables that would make it work for one person or another. unlike hypnosis which depends on ur own mind a lot.
bdbu wrote:the problem with binaurals is the science behind them suggests that it should work the same for everyone.
bdbu wrote:the problem with binaurals is the science behind them suggests that it should work the same for everyone.
[/quote]Jack wrote:Read this.
Everything is hypnosis.
Nothing is hypnosis.
I find it hilarious that all medications are tested against a hypnotic tool.
baby_jessica75 wrote:something i find funny is that what they don't mention is the fact that if the verious reasons they give for alternative explianations for the placebo working are true wouldn't it stand to reason in many of the cases where the real drugs work those same alternitive explainations could hold true?
ok but in a study where 30% of the people taking a placebo showed improvement and 60% of the people taking the medicine showed improvment. wouldn't it stand to reason that if one out of every three of the people on the placebo showed the same improvement that the 60% on the medicine. then at least 10% of the people on the medicine had what they refere to as a placebo effect
BobbyS wrote:ok but in a study where 30% of the people taking a placebo showed improvement and 60% of the people taking the medicine showed improvment. wouldn't it stand to reason that if one out of every three of the people on the placebo showed the same improvement that the 60% on the medicine. then at least 10% of the people on the medicine had what they refere to as a placebo effect
No - because that it is assuming that those same proportion of people on the medecine were getting their results from a placebo effect (regardless of the fact their changes WERE occuring from being given PHYSIOLOGICAL medecine). If you want to use research to back up a point, stick to what the results say and don't make assumptions - otherwise you defy the point of the research in the first place.
baby_jessica75 wrote:because we do not know how many people may have been getting results from what they consider a placebo effect.
Darkmind wrote:baby_jessica75 wrote:because we do not know how many people may have been getting results from what they consider a placebo effect.
But we do know. A (nearly) exact number.
The same number as in the placebo group.
Anyone else who is getting results is getting results because of the effects of the medicine. That's the point of the trial. And, for that matter, one of the main points of the existence of the FDA.
MN_FriendlyGuy wrote:This thread of conversation has taken a series of interesting twists. I'd like to contribute another twist to the conversation.
Fairly recent studies at Texas A&M University showed some interesting (scientific) results about hypnosis.
The study at Texas A&M used EEG to measure brainwaves of hypnotized (and non-hypnotized) individuals. The results proved that the brains of hypnotized individuals responded in a way that some folks might call "delusional".
The hypnotized individuals had been told that they would be shown meaningless symbols. All they needed to do was push a button to identify the color of that symbol. For these individuals the results of the EEG showed the visual area of the brain that usually decodes written words did not become active. They did NOT read the words.
By comparison, the non-hypnotized individuals took longer before pushing a button to identify the color of each color-word. These folks DID read the words. And the 'decoding' done by their brains took time.
Yes - we could this a 'placebo' effect. After all, the hypnotized folks were told to believe something untrue. And the power of their minds allowed them to respond.
Weren't they the lucky ones?
This is cool. does anyone think that maybe it is possible that since the hypnotic state is naturally accurring that maybe it is the minds way of recharging or maybe for kicking in the bodies natural healing cycles?? its just a thought!
baby_jessica75 wrote:ok maybe I am misunderstanding this. are you saying that in the group that they have on the "real" medication that they eliminate the number of people that had effects from placebo even though they are on "real" medicine. or are you saying thay they automatically assume that all of the effects are from "real" medicine and that it is supposed to be automatically accepted that what they consider "real" medicine doesn't induce any placebo effect? if I seem thick in this I'm sorry.
Darkmind wrote:This is why you test against a placebo instead of just giving out the medicine: so you know how strong the placebo effect is in this case.
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