binaurals -- theta or delta?

[busboy]

I've been working with binaural beats recently, and as I know others here use them I wanted to see about which wave pattern was considered more effective for triggers.

Almost all of the literature I've discovered focuses on the effects of theta brainwave pattern, which makes sense given the increased association and creative aspects of it. However, it seems like there would be a great benefit to the delta pattern as well. If that's the state wherein the concious mind is essentially off (non-REM sleep), then would it follow that the subconcious is essentially exposed? In terms of triggers, would dropping to delta allow a more direct impact and retention as opposed to theta, reserving theta for imagery and the like?

Curious to see if anybody has an opinion on this.

[Mirehn]

I've been working with binaural beats recently, and as I know others here use them I wanted to see about which wave pattern was considered more effective for triggers.

Almost all of the literature I've discovered focuses on the effects of theta brainwave pattern, which makes sense given the increased association and creative aspects of it. However, it seems like there would be a great benefit to the delta pattern as well. If that's the state wherein the concious mind is essentially off (non-REM sleep), then would it follow that the subconcious is essentially exposed? In terms of triggers, would dropping to delta allow a more direct impact and retention as opposed to theta, reserving theta for imagery and the like?

Curious to see if anybody has an opinion on this.

Pacing yourself down into theta will be enough. If you get yourself down into delta I doubt you will stay awake, to be frank. It is a VERY rare trance that goes that low.

[MN_FriendlyGuy]

Busboy, the questions you ask keep getting better all the time.

You asked:

In terms of triggers, would dropping to delta allow a more direct impact and retention as opposed to theta, reserving theta for imagery and the like?

As opinion, I believe the delivery of hypnosis triggers is less effective when delivered to a fully-sleeping subject (delta).

Many WMM members enjoy listening to hypnosis recordings as they sleep. I'm offering opinion that goes in a different direction, encouraging folks to sleep without distraction.

You're right. Our subconscious minds are exposed while we sleep deeply (brainwaves in the delta range). But the function of this subconscious listening is self-preservation. Our minds monitor the environment to protect us. Even as we sleep deeply, our subconscious minds listen for noise, smell for smoke, and detect changes in temperature.

The goal with hypnosis is communication that bypasses the conscious mind - without falling asleep. With binaural beats, you have the same goal... relaxed as possible without falling asleep.

If you've gained proficiency with mixing binaural beat "voices", consider mixing a single, steady voice in the delta range (at low volume) with a few other voices (higher volume). These other voices should gradually drift down from the alpha/beta ranges before stopping in the theta range. In this way, you use beat-frequency to 'invite' the mind to relax almost to the point of sleep.

The best to you as you learn!

[busboy]

@FriendlyGuy;
you may like the questions, but I love your answers!!!
Thanks for the opinion. When dealing with binaurals, I personally don't think there's such a thing as an opinion "against the grain", as there seems to be so little definitive material on the binaural beats. Heck, I can't even find an accepted frequency range! Some scientists but Delta at 0.1-3, some at 0.1-2, some put Theta at 3-5, some at 3-7, some at 2-5, etc. All the literature seems to agree on the effectiveness of the different ranges, but not quite what those ranges are or other minutia such as best volume, tone, proper mixing, etc.
I like your suggestion to mix a low Delta with a louder Theta . . . I like it very very much. My mixing skills are developing (god bless Audacity!!!), but I haven't yet gotten to the point of overlapping binaural beats, mostly out of a fear I would just end up with noise. If all that's required is to set two seperate tracks, set their respective volumes, then mix into one track then I'll have no problem. If the process starts getting into "phase" settings and other fancy buttons I haven't figured out yet, then I had better avoid it until I'm more solid . . . still burning after my earlier fiasco with binaurals.

btw, as an update on my month-long project to finally hit sonambulistic state . . . 99.9% failure. I can get to that edge, but (as I mentioned in my No2 thread) my critical faculty refuses to play nice and quit adrenaling me awake (stupid brain). I've got a few options I'm pursuing . . . in addition to trying to hit deep trance with the aid of the No2, I'm planning on trying to hit there in the next few days with the aid of the only person who got me to deep trance (once) by using a hypnosleep induction. Again, I believe that if a re-trance trigger can be planted in the sonambulistic state, I'll be able to get back to it even if I just use the trigger near the end of my usual Induction/Deepener routine. This last part (using deep planted trigger to bypass hypersensitive critical faculty) is just a hypotheses on my part, so I'm also going to try to plant some "okay if you allow yourself to drop into deep trance" commands to de-activate the CF. Before this was all an experiment, but the "need" to accomplish this is growing more serious. My girlfriend (that sounds so juvenile, but I guess it's the appropriate term) is also into hypnosis, and has no trouble going deep with me acting as tist (at least confirming my files are competent). We'd like to start using hypnosis in more erotic ways, but frankly I'm not comortable with the one-sided power exchange. I'm cetainly not opposed to "toying" with her, but with her unable to do the same to me the hypno play drifts too dangerously into a permanent Master/Slave relationship, and that neither of us are looking for (few hours, absolutely, but done at the end of the night). It's gotten to the popint I'm afraid to do any trancework whatsoever with her, because quite frankly the temptation to give triggers/suggestions is hard to resist, and the constant emphasis of "trust/like/obey/follow my voice" and other such language would no doubt slowly affect the relationship.

[Mirehn]

If you are having problem turning off the analytical part of your mind, you could try what I do with most of my subjects who have that problem... just give suggestions to turn it off! It takes some careful phrasing to make it effective, but if done well could help you reach a deep state without getting jerked awake.

[Arial]

hrm, How about delta after training with centerpointe meditation program? I'm a fantastic lucid dreamer but very rarely go deep under in trance. I would really like to and know I have been before but for only seconds at a time. I used to sleepwalk often and having the tv on or listening to music while sleeping does have an effect on my dreams. Beginning to think my highly Analytical side is a huge drawback. Perhaps even I may find someone to make me an inaudible to my conscious subliminal/autofonix trigger to listen to while sleeping. Hopefully catch me during rem. Argh I know what its like but its rare and short lived. Very frustrating.

I've used Sbagen on my mac to create several binaurals myself but tend to keep them simple and short in duration, to much fiddling with the natural flow of things can be bad.

[busboy]

@Arial:
Not familiar with centerpointe meditation program -- is it a computer program, or a system for meditation?
In my case, I initially credited the issues with being analytical, but have recently come to put the "blame" on what I can only describe as paranoia. The block seems to be primal as opposed to cognitive. By way of a related situation . . . those "fall-backward-into-everybody's-arms-and-we'll-catch-you" team building exercises? I've never been able to fall back. Regardless of my cognitive desire to do so, or my total acceptance and understanding that I will be in fact caught by evenybody behind me, my body always reflexively staggers back rather than trust others. I have no problem falling backwards if it doesn't involve other people (say, onto a matress), but if the action relies on people for safety my fight-or-flight level defensive system always says "hell no" and overrides my cognitive desires.
I suppose you could indirectly attribute it to being analytical, in the sense that my mind's mistrust of people probably stems from an understanding that people are open to error, which would be an understanding developed after analysis of people and their actions. However, I think it's something more or additional, as I know several extremely analytical people who trance like champs. In fact, almost all of the deep trancers I know are what I would consider highly analytical.