Frustrated and looking for help...

[Ladon]

Well, some of you may have noticed me around for a while now, I've posted a few files and been around the forums for several years.

I love some of the files I've found, but when I'm completely honest with myself, I can't say I can see any real results from any of them. My main interest lies in diapers/incontinence/regression, but few of the files are in the 'Goldilocks' zone for me. And those that do fit, feel more like fantasy fodder than something that could really work.

I find it hard to listen to any file that says "X will happen anytime you wear diapers" or whatever, because that implies it is automatic. The very first time it DOESN'T happen automatically, it would reinforce the idea that it can't. The reason the 'your eyes are getting very heavy' or 'your eyes want to close' type of suggestion works is because the eyes naturally WANT to close, even if just to blink, so the hypnotist is calling attention to an already existing fact.

What I've become stuck with is listening to files that have NO effects other than a trigger, then never using the trigger. I want to keep listening until I'm SURE the trigger will work. Still, with something like bedwetting, I can't voluntarily make the suggestion happen, in order to reinforce the trigger. Even moreso with commands like EMG's Potty Amnesia, which outright says 'you will forget you were ever potty trained.' I can't just make that happen.

Anyway, as I've said in other posts, I am not entirely sure I'm getting to any useful level of trance in the first place. There are lots of things I'd love to learn in hypnosis, but what I think I need at this point is someone to 'prove it' to me. I believe it works, but I have no evidence in my case.

Funds have been limited for my household for a long time, otherwise I'd offer a bounty. Still, I know there are several very talented hypnotists here and some work with people online. If someone can show me the light, I'd be very grateful, and would likely post more interesting files, at the very least.

[Ladon]

I guess I shouldn't expect much from such a wall of text, lol. I did get a nice PM and was introduced to a very nice file, dldrip009 I think.

Anyway, I just thought I'd try again. I know there are a lot of people here that HAVE seen results, and that persistence is a good trait. I do believe I CAN eventually get results, but randomly trying different files, hoping to get something to show for it is hard.

I keep trying to find one file that I really like, and can dedicate to. I've worked with good trigger files in the past, like Bubble Induction, Bedwetting Trigger, and Enchanted Keyboard. It doesn't really matter HOW many times I listen to them, the trigger isn't anything more than me going through the motions, if I am able to. In the case of the bedwetting trigger, I can't even pretend it's working.

The trouble is that I'm not interested in feminization (though hallucinating 'great big boobies' would be spectacular), and trigger files seem to be out. I can't currently decide to be a full time bedwetter or in 24/7 diapers again. I'll keep trying, but any help would be great. :)

[sarnoga]

What is it you are looking for? It is not clear to me from your two posts exactly what it is you want help with.

Sarnoga

[Ladon]

See? I get tooooo long winded and never make my point.

I'm asking for further suggestions (pardon the pun) to see some sort of result from hypnosis. A few members here have said they sometimes work with people one-on-one, either by IM or voice/vid chat.

I enjoy listening to many of the files here (especially yours, Sarnoga), but I can't say I've noticed anything happening as a result of any given file, other than a nice nap occasionally.

Is it supposed to feel like I'm just playing along? Like "I guess I'll do this, but only because I want to anyway"? I always assumed it would feel more like contagious yawns. You see someone yawning and suddenly, you find yourself yawning, without any conscious effort. (I'm yawning as I type this, just at the thought.)

[mindphuk]

I think you might be wanting it too much.

There is a rule thats saying: "Every conscious struggle causes the opposite". Ever tried willingly to fall asleep and the harder you tried the more awake you became? That's the point.

Maybe you are also wanting too much at the same time. Then you should clean up your aims, start with an easy one and then go on. Keep your focus on the aim but don't put yourself under stress to achieve it. Let it happen and stay calm about it.

It's also OK if you start with something you could or would also just do freely. At the end it doesn't matter why you do it but that you do it, and frequently. Something someone does frequently enough becomes a habit, and there it is.

[sarnoga]

See? I get tooooo long winded and never make my point.

I'm asking for further suggestions (pardon the pun) to see some sort of result from hypnosis. A few members here have said they sometimes work with people one-on-one, either by IM or voice/vid chat.

I enjoy listening to many of the files here (especially yours, Sarnoga), but I can't say I've noticed anything happening as a result of any given file, other than a nice nap occasionally.

Is it supposed to feel like I'm just playing along? Like "I guess I'll do this, but only because I want to anyway"? I always assumed it would feel more like contagious yawns. You see someone yawning and suddenly, you find yourself yawning, without any conscious effort. (I'm yawning as I type this, just at the thought.)

Hello Ladon,

I will attempt to summarize to see if I understand what you are saying.

1. While there are some results, such as feminzation, that you are not interested in, and some like incontinence and regression that you are interested in, what you would like help with is having and seeing a result for your self from any hypnosis, either from a file, in person, or any other means.

2. You are not sure you are achieving trance.


Is that a correct assessment of your situation?


If it is not then I guess I am still not understanding. If it is then I have the following to say about it:


Obviously there is no point in bothering with issue #1 until you have resolved issue #2. Trying to address them both at the same time is a waste of time and energy that will greatly complicate matters. While you could address it that way and might by chance stumble into some success, it is no way to try to figure out what is or is not going on.

One approach might be to seek out someone to work individually with you, in person or through some sort of real time electronic communication. That seems to be the approach you are trying to take by making this forum post. You may find someone to work with you and live happily ever after. Best of luck.

Since I do not work with people in real time, rather than to just cast you loose, letting you drift in hope of finding rescue, I will offer some suggestions. Call them ideas or thoughts if you prefer.

Just forget about issue #1. Put it out of your mind, abandon it, for now. It is worthless and useless, worse than that it is counter productive and confusing the issue. There is more than enough time to come back and look at that later after you have resolved issue #2. And until you resolve issue number #2 there is no point even looking at issue #1.

You can see how poorly planned my response is. Had I given it much tought I would have renumbered the issues so that we could address issue #1 first followed by issue #2. Though in a sense we are addressing issue #1 first. We are ignoring it.

As to issue #2. I am contending that there is no point moving on to issue #1, until #2 is resolved. You must first learn to go into trance. Practice trance, keep at it and be persistant. Until you know you are going into trance there is no point worrying about getting results from suggestions. You may find that once you are going into trance that you have no problem getting results from suggestions.

Or, you may find that once you are going into trance you are still not getting results from suggestions. If that is the case the proper time to address that, if it is a problem, is after you know you are trancing well. Until then, what is the point, as the problem may lay in going, or not going, into trance, or possibly going into trance but not deep enough.

So anyway, lets focus on issue #2, going into trance. One problem in addressing this issue is this.....

Many people feel that the proper test of whether they are achieving trance is to see results from suggestions. Abandon that way of looking at it. I once had a number of similar discussions with someone who had similar problems to those you are articulating. I suggested that they listen to one of my older files, Sarnoga - The Road Home. It is an induction and nothing more. They had been having difficulty getting into trance and they said they were able to learn to put themself into a trance with the help of that file.

I am not claiming that particular file is the right file for you, though it may be. For you some other file might be the one that does it, if any will. But what I am suggesting is that you stop bothering with any files except inductions until you are sure you are going into trance well.

And you are now left saying to me.... that all sounds great Sarnoga, but just how the hell am I supposed to know if I am going into trance or how well I am going into trance.

Unfortunately you will probably find my answer to that inadequate. That is one of the benefits of your other plan of action, that is finding someone to work individually with you in person, or at least real time where they can observe you. A hypnotist who can observe you can tell more easily when you are going into trance. All I can really say is from my own experience. And that is you will know it when it happens. There may be others here that can give you better information on how to know when you are in trance, or if you have been in trance, because you may be trying to decide after if you have been in trance rather than thinking about it while possibly in trance.

But if they tell you that you can tell because you will be getting suggestions to work, I would advise abandoning that test. That is just going to put you right back in the situation you are in right now where you are confusing things by trying to do it all at one time rather than breaking it down into logical parts and dealing with one issue at a time.

In case I have been too wordy and confused things myself, let me once again summarize in an attempt at clarity.

Forget about getting substantive results from files. For now, stop using any files that promise any kind of "results" at all beyond taking you into trance.

Listen only to inductions, until you are sure you are going into trance. Just keep trying different inductions until you either find one that works, or find one you find pleasant to listen to even if it does not produce immediate results.

If you find one that seems to work stick with it until you are either sure it does or sure it doesn't.

If you find one that is pleasant to listen to stick with it until it is working for you or you are reasonably sure it is not working. If it is not working start looking for another.

Going into trance using Mp3 files is self hypnosis. The file may be an aid but it is still self hypnosis. The file is simply a tool to help you with your self hypnosis. Learning to hypnotize yourself is a skill. As with any such skill it can be improved with practice. In my opinion it is also more an art than a science. That means there is no "once size fits all" approach that you can count on. Play around, experiment, try out the various tool or files at your disposal and find what work for you.

Once you are sure you are practiced at going into trance and doing it well, then it will be time to search out a simple file and see if you can get it to work. One bit of advise I have seen here in these forums many times, and that I tend to agree with, is this. Start with something really easy and simple. Work with it until it works. Then build upon that success. Success breeds success.

I hope this was helpful. If not, keep looking. Best wishes and best of luck.

Sarnoga.

[Ladon]

Wow, I know it takes time to write a post like that, thank you.

While I'm not sure, if I had to guess, I'd say that I have (on occasion) actually been in a trance, usually using Blink's Basic or the Furniture Shop, and more recently, dldrip's file. I liked Road Home, but it didn't seem to be quite right for me.

I usually am not aware of when it happened, much like with falling asleep, thinking back you just can't remember exactly when it happened. That seems natural, as the conscious was otherwise occupied at the time, if it WAS a trance. I might have just been asleep.

Regarding your final insight, that makes perfect sense. In my reading of both Erickson and Bandler/Grinder, it was mentioned that a key is for the 'subject' to succeed, regardless of the result.

I think I'll find or make a good lucid dreaming file, because I know I'm able to do that, I used to LD almost every night, before I even knew it wasn't ordinary to do so. Outright statements, like "You will have a lucid dream whenever you listen to this file" just seem like a recipe for failure, even if the trance is good.

I think.

:)

I'll put your suggestions to work, even if I don't see results right away.

Ladon

[elisabet]

There is also more than one way to get into trance as well. Or at least more than one kind of induction. I liken induction styles to learning styles - some people are primarily one or the other, some people learn best by a mix of the different styles. For example - in a progressive relaxation induction most of the time it references thinking about your feet. I have nerve damage in my feet, and it tosses me right out of trance. Long inductions work very badly for me because I get bored easily :-) When working with someone who tends to do long inductions I have to continually use a trance trigger to stay down.

However one of my Sirs tends to string inductions together when he listens t files in order to achieve results. He just doesn't go 'deep' easily and the mix of styles, lengths and voices tends to help him a great deal.

I've also heard a lot about conditioning. (And seen the results myself!) With my Master's voice, especially when he's recording (when he says it is safe for me to do so) just his 'hypnosis' voice will send me spiraling down. Same with the other two Sirs that I work with regularly and the one person's files I listen to regularly as well. So maybe listening to one hypnotist's work might help? Getting used to how it feels, conditioning yourself to their voice?

And have you thought about visiting a practicing hypnotherapist to learn how to self-hypnotize or listening to a file that helps you set a personal trance trigger? And remember to relax! Don't expect anything. Just enjoy the mental massage.

Good luck! The results when you get there are well worth the effort.

~elisabet.

[Ladon]

I've never had any trouble relaxing, that's one nice thing. I do tend to go along and 'look' for tense muscles. At times, I have to adjust my pillow several times to get my neck just so, no tension required to hold it where it is, and also no stress from the angle.

I can relate to certain phrases not working for you, as pretty much anything that says 'imagine' or 'picture in your mind' just ... fail. I have very limited 'visualization' abilities.

[elisabet]

Ah, see! You do need a different style. I'm willing to bet that you would respond really well to a rapid or shock induction in person. :-) Most online 'tists don't use other styles because they use what appeals to the most people. I really do suggest finding someone to work with in person who is familiar with the different styles. Good luck /smiles.

[DKaiser]

Ah, see! You do need a different style. I'm willing to bet that you would respond really well to a rapid or shock induction in person. :-) Most online 'tists don't use other styles because they use what appeals to the most people. I really do suggest finding someone to work with in person who is familiar with the different styles. Good luck /smiles.

I second that, go look around for different styles of hypnosis, to see what works for you.

That said, hazarding a guess, you'd work well with hypnosis that is "supportive", for lack of a better word. Stuff that leads you on through a logical progression of suggestions, and tends to give suggestions that are just trying to help you with effects, rather than saying "thou shalt do this". Not all that useful for the stronger effects, but starting with simple ones, your mind builds up the idea that it can work, and thus is more readily open to different styles that work better with stronger effects.

[mindphuk]

I usually am not aware of when it happened, much like with falling asleep, thinking back you just can't remember exactly when it happened. That seems natural, as the conscious was otherwise occupied at the time, if it WAS a trance. I might have just been asleep.

I don't know if I understood you correctly. But, how did you awake? If you did at the end of the file, you have not been asleep...

I think I'll find or make a good lucid dreaming file, because I know I'm able to do that, I used to LD almost every night, before I even knew it wasn't ordinary to do so. Outright statements, like "You will have a lucid dream whenever you listen to this file" just seem like a recipe for failure, even if the trance is good.

Hm, if you know lucid dreaming and practiced it already, did you ever try to use it to find an answer for your questions there?

This should be possible, because you communicate with your subconscious mind there, and it knows why it acts so and so. The question is just how it will answer, and to get and understand an answer it needs maybe more practice.

[renzhee]

What is it you are looking for?