I need some help

[wmxx]

I’m condensing from a tired memory. This is from about 7-8 hrs of talking. Some we will keep private, but so much more. It is the most we have ever talked, and everything came out, everything.

[wmxx]

Ugh I just can’t sleep my mind is so restless. I asked him why he is so giving and cares so much about people? He said I watched my grandfather give to everyone that was his friend, family, neighbor, etc. He not only put me through college he put 3 kids in the neighborhood through college. He rarely gave to charitable causes. He told me that. Why would I give to those I don’t know especially when a percentage of that money goes to administrators making millions, when I have people that have touched my life up close and personal. He said he liked to give them just enough so it was an investment in their future, or helped them feel better about themselves, so they can feel like they are meaningful. I watched him do it over and over. Very often he did it in secret, because he wasn’t interested in being a hero, he was genuine. I was not happy with Amy when your shop was forced to close. I knew how much you loved your girls, and When I gave her money for everyone to split, I made her promise never to tell you, but she did. Why are you so interested in helping Nicole after just one night? She moved me to tears telling about her hospitalization from a relationship, having a very good job, losing it to covid, having to move from a nice apartment to a small one, not in a great area, losing another job for the same reason, and struggling. I’m sure her life is not going well, you saw her car! She didn’t deserve that, and I’ll bet she has had to deal with it all alone, no therapy. What Justin doesn’t know is when Nicole and I were talking, I asked her if she was on any birth control, and she said yes, but I don’t need it. She told me the condition she had, but I don’t remember it. That is the reason she took this route to begin with. She wanted to try being a 3rd in a relationship. She loved us, and she said nobody ever treated her like she was here. She felt like she mattered not just in bed, all the way around. Justin was so excited to have a chance to have a day and night with her. Yes, because he wants us to have that kind of relationship, but he wanted to allow Nicole to get secure with him so he could dig down into where she is in life and help her. I know Justin, he will help her even if he never sees her again. He also said to me. I apologize because I proposed a car and money for Nicole. I just want you to know, if you want a new car also, it will be here ASAP. I don’t want you to feel slighted in any way. I also hope you know that you can go out and get one anytime you want, I already told you what is mine is yours. He always includes me, and look what I did. I’m a complete ass! I will fix it! We have a lot more talking to do. Justin said, I could buy Nicole a huge house and set her up for life, but that doesn’t help her become self sufficient. I don’t think you even realize what my grandfather left me. I couldn’t spend it all, I have spent none of it, it is just a security blanket. I’d rather use it to help people, that would make him proud of me. I was so proud of him!

[wmxx]

Really late night. I see what Amber wrote. She is sleeping on the couch. I need a hug really bad, but no way I can wake her, I see she has been up all night. The one thing that really helped me is when she came in and told me she was done with Glenn. She was showing me her true priority. It touched me hard. She said at 4 today when he is home from work she will let him know and I will be right by her side watching her tell him, and any subsequent texts. She has owned her actions, and I respect that. While communication, security and trust are all integral parts of a healthy relationship, so is forgiveness, especially over punishment. She told me last night she still wants me to spend Saturday night with Nicole. She said she would spend the weekend in. Motel. To me that would just worsen our problem. It would be like punishing her. I feel the same way about telling her she has to back off Glenn for awhile. That would be emotionally painful and another form of punishment. That isn’t what I want. Our problem is how Glenn came to be, which I played a major role in. She helped me understand what she is getting out of that relationship. It really helped to know. He isn’t a malicious entity, and I always like to take something positive out of a situation. I thought we communicated very well, we don’t until last night. We opened up everything. We are both to blame. I held in some thoughts about her loving Glenn. I understand much better now. Glenn is only a problem because it was one sided. She is spending the night with him, I’m home thinking all kinds of things alone. To her credit she seemed to understand that and offered me Nicole. It wasn’t something I was interested until I started doing a lot of reading about those relationships. Fewer marriages end in divorce in that type of relationship, and I don’t want us to become a statistic. What makes them fail is you are on a line of trust and security and communication needs to happen in spades, like last night and on a regular basis. That is what we have to do right now, and we can succeed

[wmxx]

I really want to help Nicole regardless of what happens. After hearing her relationship and job hardships, it really hit me. Then Amber telling about her inability to have children. My question is does she have health insurance? Is the situation correctable? If it is I will get it corrected for her. That had to be the worst news a woman of 26 or younger when she found out could ever hear. I have to see her, and I have to earn her trust and see where she is at. I think I am on a missionary road, and if something comes out of it fine, but if she comes out of this with a chance to one day have children of her own, If be much happier. I can see why this path for her makes sense now. I hope somehow, I can give her other options. None of this is her fault.

[wmxx]

I sent this just now to Amber:

Https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB6yjGVuzVo

[wmxx]

Amber this is for you:

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. 8 Love never fails
*********************+*************************
This is a high bar to clear, it takes a lot of work. I believe in unconditional love, I also know as a human I am not capable of it. What I am capable of is trying. Nothing at the highest level of achieving such as a love like this is given. If it is worth it, there is a lot of work involved. I am committed completely to work as hard as I can to achieve this with you. I love you that much!

[danny1988]

Been absent for a bit but mostly caught up.
Glad to see your both communicating a lot more and no more use of hypnosis. With what you both are experimenting with it’s best to have a clear head.

While I’m not that experienced in some aspects of this it’s clear to be you just need to be careful when promising or saying yes to things in the moment.
I’ve done it before said he’s to two people and upset both of them that was only something minor too.

Amber you need to look after your primary relationship above all others, but what’s happened is an easy mistake and easily done. Your both new to this so there will be bumps. Just talk openly about your feelings and learn from them is all I can offer here.

Justin you sound a lot like me in regard to strong but sensitive and very giving and caring, again just look after your primary relationship with Amber, be careful with helping too many people so not to burn yourself out.

Keep communicating between each other like you have and you will be able to sort things out I’m sure.

[wmxx]

I can’t believe I slept past lunchtime. Justin truly is an amazing man. Danny you are right again, thank you. I learned a valuable lesson, I didn’t thing I was doing anything wrong, because I didn’t think about what I was doing. I will never drop my guard again. We talked for another hour. He went out to get some groceries told me to just relax, we are ok. Most of the talk was about Nicole and Glenn. He said he wants to spend Friday late afternoon until Sunday noonish with Nicole and why. I think he established that here. He said I don’t expect you to do nothing. I’m very ok with you going to Glenn’s. We need to however talk a couple of times per day, so we don’t run into issues, we need that. This of course depends on Glenn and Nicole. Let me text Nicole first and if it is a go, then contact Glenn. If Nicole is a no, or Glenn is a no, then it is off. We do this together or not at all. So both or neither. I totally agreed with that. He text Nicole and asked her if she had any hard plans for the weekend. She said no why are you asking? He text back and said I am going to try an Amber with you. How would you feel on a scale of 1-10 to come over Friday after work, and leave Sunday at noonish? It will be just me and you. She text back 10++. We were both a bit surprised. He said great, just leave from work and come over. Glenn is just getting home, I’m texting him now, but I’m sure it will be a yes.

[wmxx]

Glenn is a yes. I’m so glad we are doing this. This is our chance to shine. We are both a lot more conscious of each other. I’m betting by the time we get home together at noon on Sunday, we will be making love like never before, and our appreciation for each other will be at an all time high. I truly hope he connects with Nicole, and I mean that for all the right reasons. By her text of 10++ I know she already has the hots for Justin, I think Justin has his focus on her, not being with her. I just know him too well, but we will see.

[wmxx]

I picked up some ready to serve meals, I realize Amber is tired, so am I. She is cuddling up to me now. Just a quickie here. Nicole said could I ask you the same 1-10 question, I said a 10. She asked if we were hanging out or going anywhere, I need to know what clothes I need. I asked her what would be best for you? She said I’d be happy just hanging out. I said would you like to go out to eat? Go out and see a band? Your choice, anything. She said I’ll bring clothes for both, just in case ok? I said great, looking forward to it, she said me too. Ok time for me and Amber now.

[wmxx]

One last thing. I told Amber we would be sleeping in the spare bedrooms, not our bed. Last thing she needs to do is have to change a bed that another woman slept in, and I would strip both beds and make them back up. She said she never thought about that, but it didn’t really matter.

[wmxx]

Nicole just text me and asked if I had any favorite colors for me to wear. I said I don’t think there is a color out there that you wouldn’t look fantastic in, your choice. She said thank you, one more thing, do you have a favorite perfume? I said np preference, but actually I only want to smell it on Amber. Time for dinner.

[wmxx]

Taking a break we are setting all our comfort zones that we agree on. Those are easy. Now we are taking on very tough ones. What happens if we are both in relationships and one ends. Can the other still see their partner? If so how often? Overnights? Gets complicated. Can you get high on weed? No other drugs allowed. Can you travel with your secondary partner if yes how many days? Sex- oral ok or no? Penetration? Those have already been determined as yes. Can you have sex with anyone else beside your other partner? If so just 1 time or any limit? Can you spend the night with someone other than your other partner? Do you want your partner to know what you did each time they are with their partner? Some of it? Keep it private? Are there any places off limits to take out your other partner to? What places are ok? Can you have a 3 way with your other partner? If the other persons partner is away is there limits to time you spend with yours? Is there a limit to over nights if allowed? If they are is their a limit to the frequency or as needed? If over nights ok is there a limit to how many in a row? These are the harder ones and there is more

[wmxx]

A real big one. Is alcohol consumption allowed? What if you drink too much? Do you spend the night even if you were not supposed to? Do you call an Uber? Some people change when they drink alcohol? Never get in a car if both are intoxicated call Uber. We don’t drink much at all but still need to discuss this. Same with weed and driving same questions.

[wmxx]

This is where the understanding and negotiating starts. How many over nights per week?

Justin 1 of each
Amber 1 and 2 overnights

Justin compromise offer 1 overnight, one week then 2 the following week alternating. Split our gap.

Amber 0 other visits 2 overnights.

I told him we are doing 2 this week? I suggested we wait to finalize until after this week. Right now I’m in a committed relationship you are not. You might feel different after this week, so how about if we wait on this one.

Justin. Agree, makes sense. These require total honesty why and you have to try and understand each other’s needs as well as the other partners limits

[wmxx]

Last one we are both tired need some lovin.

How do you handle your parter that wants you to leave your primary relationship or starts a conversation about it?

Justin: I would politely say that isn’t anything I will discuss. Please don’t ask me that again, because I will never leave.

Amber: I will never leave, so that conversation is not even on the table.

Should you share that this was asked by your primary partner?

Amber: Everything significant like that has to be shared. Everything! Even the most uncomfortable.

Justin: absolutely followed by making your partner know that is not an option at all. I love you ahead of all others.

What if you personally even day dream about leaving your primary love?

Justin: If I ever thought that was a possibility, I would never get into a polyamorous relationship. On the off hand I did, I would tell her immediately and realize I need to end my secondary relationship, but again that will never come up for me, I have way too much discipline for that to ever happen, and love Amber way too much to ever hurt her like that or any other way.

Amber:

I will never face that question. But I have to answer so I will. I messed up with Glenn on something much less, and I was going to end it with Glenn immediately, because Justin is and always be my man.

[wmxx]

Amber and I were talking in bed last night and she came to the realization that this weekend will be the longest we have been without seeing each other since we moved in together. Today we have to tackle some difficult issues. One is, The safety issue. One, is your secondary partner allowed to have other relationships? If they do, the issue of safe sex moves into the spotlight. There has to be communication on that front. How do you handle it? How often do you talk about it? What are your hard lines on it? This is certainly high on the priority list. Even if your partner has a one night stand, how do you deal with the STD potential issues, because you are now responsible for 4 people all together not just 2.

Lying, security, and communication:

This is the heart and soul of a polyamory us relationship. If any of these 3 are not ultra emphasized you are heading for the end of your relationship. In a polyamourous relationship a lie is worse than cheating in a monogamous relationship. If you don’t have a deep trust of your partner do not even attempt to do this, you will fail. One lie will end your relationship period. Make sure you both know that there are going to be very difficult issues to be truthful about. Your partner should have any questions answered he needs including the depth of your love with your other partner. At first, this is exceedingly difficult to have to answer if your deeply into a committed relationship with your lover. The benefit is, if you do everything right, and your partner is secure because you go out of your way to show your love has actually grown because of your new lifestyle, he/she will genuinely be happy for you. That to me is the holy grail. To be so secure, that whatever the depth of love your partner had with another, the more it enhances your own relationship. This is a long way off. We have to put in the work, and the work is fun negotiating boundaries actually starts the process of bringing each other closer. It’s always been about communication. I have read at least 100 couples and 10 shrinks view. The shrinks tend to form a consensus that relationships like this are on the rise. The divorce rate is lower. The level of love is so much deeper. The shrinks say the reason is this requires so much communication and an over-emphasis on each other when you are together it strengthens the bond between you. Amber has already told me, she feels so much better about me having Glenn and she believes that if Nicole and I bond together, I will know what she means. Nicole is a really beautiful well put together sweet woman. I have no doubt I will enjoy her. I am however more on a mission to get her comfortable around me, so I can figure out or told directly why she can’t get pregnant and if there is some type of surgical procedure to restore that, I will do that for her. I know this seems so counterintuitive, because without helping her she may desire being the secondary partner because she feels her options are so limited. If I fell hard for her at some point, I’d get her surgically repaired and walk away. She would be whole again, and that will always be the right thing to do. I may not get all that this time, but hopefully there will at least be another time. My emotions hopefully can withstand her beauty, before I get in too deep. Breakfast time.

[wmxx]

We are just sitting down to get ourselves solid boundaries. A couple more.

How do you feel about Holidays? Birthdays, piggy back Holidays, XMas Eve-XMas? New Years Eve-New Years Day. Remember always partners may change, so consider not just current situation. All these can be renegotiated, and should be reviewed weekly. If something isn’t working, renegotiate.

Schedule with your lover (both)

This is very important. If you have a few days a week with your lover and so does your partner, you will not have enough time together, which ultimately will cause jealousy or the lack of quality time together will eat away at your relationship. Try and sync together both of your schedules and eliminate or minimize days or overnights, that are the same. There is nothing worse than your primary partner sitting home alone on a weekend or any day or night, because all that will be thought about is missing you, and even worse visualizing you having passionate lovemaking sessions, and create a bad situation....I definitely have a better understanding of that after the other night. Basically Justin has had to deal with that since day 1. I’m starting to learn something from Justin. Consider being on the other end of what your doing with your partner before you do something last minute and unexpected. If I thought about that the other night, everything could of been better. Lesson learned.

The ultimate goal is to become polyamorous, free to be in a committed loving relationship with someone other than your primary partner. The rewards are extremely high, the risks? If you have a deeply loving relationship, and it is a prerequisite to even try this, you set and follow your negotiated boundaries and communicate all the tender difficult things, and never ever LIE, your chances of greatly enhancing your relationship is very high. There will be bumps in the road, and that is where your strong relationship and developing communication skills will make the difference. Always remember the Cardinal rule: NEVER lie no matter how hard it is to tell the truth. You will find the most difficult areas where truth prevails will strengthen your relationship as trust will skyrocket.

[wmxx]

So the time issue comes up with scheduling. We can’t quite agree but we are close. I want a little more time and more overnights, Justin wants a bit less. We thought it would be better to find common ground after this weekend. I think after Justin has this weekend he may move closer to me on this. I’m hoping anyway. My suggestion was if this works this weekend both our partners work and are out by 3 for Nicole, and 3:30 for Glenn. If we did every weekend like this weekend Friday and Saturday night and be together Sunday we have Monday- most of Friday with each other and all day Sunday. I would even think it would be better to include Sunday so 3 overnights and the rest with Justin. He thinks that might be too much. I’m in a loving relationship and it has to also be nourished. I hope after this weekend he understands that better. So that one is on hold until next week.

[wmxx]

Another tender issue:

What if your lover sets up a very romantic candlelight dinner at home for you both? Is that acceptable? How about you personally doing that for them? Also how about unconventional sex? Bondage, domination, threesome, or anything out of the mainstream?

We both agree the romance is ok initiated by either party.

Unconventional sex Justin said that should be reserved for us, the STD risk can be screened beforehand like we have done, but he thinks it should be for us only.

I thought the same for most except that a threesome if it ever was brought up, was ok.

After going through and discussing I sided with Justin. So I guess he won that one. He just said it could become very complicated doing that and I could see his point. He added, as time goes on maybe that can be reopened but doesn’t think that will help us in any way. I agreed after thinking about it

[wmxx]

Justin just did a compromise after thinking about it and hearing my feelings about over nights. One thing about this is you are forced to be brutally honest, and you have to talk about some really tender things. Listening to other couples it is extremely hard at the beginning and you have to talk in a tender way, and make sure your main partner is left feeling secure, and unthreatened. When we were negotiating, it just isn’t a number it is why you need the number. I told Justin I am very in love with Glenn. I also want you to know, no matter how much I love him he will never replace you. I hope after my stupid decision the other night. I was going to stop seeing him completely, because your my true and always number 1. When you are in love and having sex and time for just a limited amount of talking, it just isn’t enough to maintain an intimate relationship. I hugged him, and let him know it doesn’t change how much I love you, in fact I love you more. It’s hard for you right now, because until you feel and experience it, you just can’t. If this is the life we are building we will both need it. This isn’t easy to look you in the eyes and say, but I have to for this to work. After he digested it all he suggested, I understand. I’m going to likely need more than this weekend with Nicole to dig down and see where she is at. I would agree to do this next weekend as well, and then we can talk about going forward from there ok? I gave him a long kiss and told him how much I loved him. This is definitely going to enhance my relationship with Glenn. So needed!

[wmxx]

These are not easy but have to be discussed:

Your main partner just lost his secondary partner, and they were in a committed relationship, how do you handle your other committed partner. You have to deal with your main partner crying over losing another man/woman. This will almost executable happen at some point:

Justin : this can get sticky. I think because your primary partner is always most important, and it is a great time of need, I would give her a lot of comfort and support and be there for her. I would limit my time, or eliminate time from my secondary partner for a period of time needed. The last thing I’d want to do is spend a weekend away when she may need me the most.

Amber: It would be necessary to be with him and give him as much love and empathy he needed. My other partner would have to wait. I would give Justin all my attention

[wmxx]

There is a term called compression. It occurs when both begin to experience great joy that their main partner has a deeply loving relationship with their other partner. That is the goal. You get past the doubts and trust issues and you love that your partner is experiencing that. That is the mountain top!

[wmxx]

This is hard trying to negotiate some things. It is only because I’ve already been in another committed relationship and Justin hasn’t. As much as he says he understands that I need more time with Glenn, he doesn’t. By the same respect, as much as I feel I understand how it is for him to be at home by himself while I’m out making love to another man, I really don’t even though I think I do. That distorts how much more time I need with Glenn. To him less and me more. We have agreed to review this after the next two weeks. I’m certain then he will understand a lot better. Justin text Nicole during her lunch break, and asked her if everything goes well this weekend, if she was open to doing the same next weekend? He added I really would like to get to know you, and just let the time we spend together decide where this will go. It will speak for itself. She responded, I absolutely would love it! But... I really like Amber a lot. Are you sure this is all ok with her? I assured her it was, and she really likes you as well. Text her about it if you feel you need to. I believe you, yes I would love to! I said great! Let’s see how this weekend goes, and I’m sure it will go well, and if so we will do it again! She said I’m excited, have been thinking about this all week! I hope you like me. She is already got feelings for being with Justin, pretty clear. I think he is in for a surprise. By the time she has 2 days with Justin she will be ga ha. That’s my prediction. Justin on the other hand, I’m not sure. He isn’t taken easily, but once he is, he will treat her better than she has ever experienced. I want this lifestyle more than anything and so does Justin be it Nicole or someone else. We both understand the work needed in communicating. I think we really stumbled across something we will thrive in and do it together.

[wmxx]

This is very difficult:

What if one of you has a lover that is friends with your primary relationship?

Does she have break contact with her? (Specifically regarding Nicole and Justin). Threesomes end? Only contact is when Justin is not with us?

Justin:

Wow. I think that I should never be with both Amber and Justin. My reason is I would certainly give more attention to Amber, but could Amber handle whatever attention I gave to Nicole? How does Nicole feel if I’m all into Amber? I would feel like no matter what I did both would perhaps be uncomfortable. Threesomes would have to be out for the same reason. Amber and Nicole together without me I think could be ok. Amber getting sexual with Nicole would be ok by me.

Amber:

I don’t think I’d have a problem with any of the situations, but I have think about how Nicole would feel. I think if all 3 of us were together and Justin was hanging off Nicole the whole time, I may get jealous and worry.

We talked deeper about this. I understand the issues it could create. I would personally want to hear Nicole’s voice on this. Justin is going to bring it up this weekend. If he sleeps with her, which is pretty obvious, then he will have that conversation and we will revisit.

There are so many things to really dig into. You have to get the vital ones right, some of these will be renegotiated as time goes forward.

Drinking or high and driving:

Justin: I’m very clear on this one, NEVER I lost parents because of someone that did. No more need be said. Totally inflexible on this. If both are not fit to drive call an Uber, a friend or me, I will pick you both up, not a word said. If you are both home and both incapable of driving, and it is not an overnight, call an Uber, or make it an overnight, anything else is completely off limits.

Amber:

I know Justin’s answer, and that is my answer. Neither of us drink more than 1-2 drinks almost ever. So not likely to come up. As far as weed Glenn really can’t unless it is a long weekend, and I won’t be doing it alone, so probability low. I would say if it wasn’t a planned spend the night, then an exception has to be made and an overnight should be the answer but must call your primary partner.

[wmxx]

We are both looking forward to this. It’s a lot of work, and we are both not afraid of that. We will do everything successful couples have done, with our own boundaries. I think we each have excitement for this weekend for different reasons. I know for Amber this will be the most consecutive time she has spent with Glenn. I hope she comes home feeling better about their situation, because it could go the other way, and she will be hurt, and I don’t wish that on anyone, especially Amber. I can tell she wants this because she is really focused on putting together our boundaries, and so am I. It does actually bring you closer compromising with the one you love. Indirectly this is teaching us valuable relationship lessons. For me, I just have an open mind. If anything comes out of this I’m going to be happy. If it was based on looks, it would be a no brainer. I have other objectives but I’m not going to hit hard on any personal stuff this weekend. I want to build 1 to1 conversation that makes her comfortable with me. If I didn’t sleep with her, I will not be disappointed.

[wmxx]

So Glenn text me and he said it is supposed to be really nice Saturday, do you have something in mind that you would like to do? Also Saturday Night? I was hoping he would plan something out, wanted to see how creative he is. So I text him back and I said I want you to surprise me, but if it requires certain clothes, let me know please so I can dress properly. He said he would come up with something. This is where he differs from Justin. He knows nothing about Nicole along those lines. He told her he wanted to take her Friday to an XMas light show, that has Santa, 100s of thousands of lights, actual reindeer. He said he would bring a thermos of hot chocolate for us on Friday Night. It is supposed to be pretty warm but you might want to bring a sweatshirt or jacket. If you get cold I can give you mine or snuggle up with you. She responded can I get cold on purpose so you will snuggle me:)? He text back I like your plan better. I have always wanted to see that, sounds like fun! He said if you get here on time, I have a tiny bottle of champagne and 2 glasses, and we will watch the sunset on the beach, and some other goodies. Nicole omg you are planning all these things. I wish it was Friday! Saturday I want to go out to brunch with you and just spend the rest of our day together undisturbed, I want to really get to know Nicole. I want you to ask and learn about Justin. My only expectation is by noon Sunday you can go home and smile that I had a really nice weekend. I already know it is going to be nice, because I’m going to be with an amazingly nice guy. I will too if the sweet Nicole that I met last week. Enjoy your evening see you around 3:30 Friday! Thank you, you too! <muah>. ❤️
Yeah a bit jealous here, but that is Justin being Justin. After she sent that heart he put his arms around me and said I love you, You have nothing to worry about I will never disappoint you or hurt you ever. I promised you that a longtime ago, and I have and always will be yours! I’m glad I know him so well. He just wants people he is around that he likes to be happy. She’s going to fall so hard for him she will never land, I so see it coming and Justin who is watching me text this is going to get seduced by her beauty and sweetness watch! I can only hope Glenn has at least some creativity.

[wmxx]

Now Nicole just text me. Hi Amber, are you sure you are ok with me being with Justin this weekend? I text back, I am positive, don’t worry. You have an amazing man, I don’t want to create any problems for you. He is and for the next two weekends, he is yours, and maybe a lot more of them. Thank you so much! I’m so nervous about all this, but so excited also. I know Justin if you are nervous when you get there, he will relax you in a minute. Have fun! I know I will, hope we can get together next week at my place. I have some heels and clothes you may want. Sounds good let’s see how all this goes ok. Ok thanks. Have a good night! You too!

That was so hard writing that, I’m feeling jealous, I need some Justin right now.

[wmxx]

I asked Justin if he is nervous about being with Nicole the whole weekend. He said yes, but not in the way you think. I’m nervous about you. I’ve been true to you since day one. I’ve been true to every woman I have been with. Now I’m not going to be, it is like I’m dating her. I worry how it will be for you when I come home and you ask me a lot of questions. I’m going to give you truthful answers whatever they happen to be. I don’t want any of those answers to be hurtful to you. I want to do this, but I do worry about you. Well, I just said I really trust you. I want you to just let things be whatever the moment brings. I can tell you right now she is going to fall head over heels for you. He responded by saying isn’t that what we are working toward? I said yes, but it might not feel good the first time. I think I will be ok, if I’m not just reassure me. I definitely will. I’ll make you a promise. If you feel you can’t handle it, there will be no next week meaning the week after ok? It won’t come to that, and if you spend your whole weekend worrying, you will take away from your own weekend, so don’t do that to your self. Let’s walk each other through this, and we will be in a better place. I will come home loving you as much as ever that is a promise I can keep. I adore you! You are my life. I want you to be my life always as well. I have to think positive thoughts.

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I told Amber I am treating Nicole like a gift from her. A gift never is used against the giver, I hope you think of Glenn the same wsy

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This is a conflict for all that say to set boundaries

rules can’t protect a relationship. Only mutual commitment, respect, and compatibility can do that.

If you and your partner have a relationship that’s benefitting both of you, that you’re both giving sufficient time and attention to, that’s founded on mutual love, trust, and respect, then you don’t need rules to keep it safe.

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There will be times when it’s hard and scary, and times when it’s exhilarating and life-giving. It can take some time to figure out how — or even if — polyamory works best in your life.

Embrace the process.

Ultimately, the goal is to deepen and strengthen your relationship with your #1 partner.

We share that goal. I know Justin is all for anything that has statistical value over whatever is happening by a current methodology.

I have read tons on this as well. It also gave how to deal with jealousy because you will sooner or later feel it. It doesn’t mean you failed, it means you have to learn how to deal with it. I’m reading. We are all in on this, clear minded and studying successes. Our life changes in about 36 hours. You have to reprogram your mind to love the enjoyment your partner is getting, and him you. If successful your love between you and your partner will elevate significantly. That will be me and Justin. We put a lot of work in this. We will continue to. Time to go make love to him, and hold him all night. I love him so much!

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I started doing a lot of reading about jealousy. Nicole isn’t helping but she is just trying to be herself which is sweet and thoughtful. I shouldn’t be jealous of her, but she is so pretty and I wish I had her boobs, but I will soon. Last night Justin shared her texts as we agreed. She asked him what his favorite cookies were. He loves the peanut butter blossoms. She said I will bake some for you after work tonight. Now I feel guilty because here is a woman that has known him for a week and she is making them for him, and I only made them once for him and it was before we started living together. He said that is so nice, what is your favorite? She said I try not to eat cookies and stuff because I gain weight. No wonder why she has a body like that, I have to get on the bike again. I’m a typical woman I guess, always comparing, but especially now, because Justin is spending 2 straight weekends with her. I knew this was going to be really hard for me, but I have never backed down from a challenge. She also said she would like to make dinner for him Saturday night, or it would be fun to make it together. I sort of feel like she is moving in. It’s almost like I want Justin to have a good time, but not too good of a time, if you know what I mean. Justin has been very helpful calming my worries. Last night he put some mood music on, and we actually danced in the bedroom. He made love to me and held me, and really poured his heart out to me. I know he would never hurt me, this isn’t about him and Nicole, it is about me. Justin lifted me out of so many fears and insecurities, if not there is 0 chance I could ever embrace a relationship like this. Justin has totally embraced it. He is knee deep in reading and sharing with me. We know what is terminal in a relationship like this. A single lie not only ends this type of relationship it very well could end your own relationship. The ability to answer some difficult questions about you and your lover, and be able to accept how much love they have for their other partner has to be met with reassurance, so each remains secure. Justin is trying to, more successfully than me, embracing my love for Glenn. He has put all his trust and faith in me. He does worry most about me, and that actually feels good, but it isn’t something new, he never has wavered in that regard ever. When he feels a sense of betrayal like the other night, he is so sensitive it is really hard for him. That will never happen again. I know one thing. I could get deeper into my relationship with Glenn and there isn’t a chance I will ever leave Justin, not even a micro chance. I know that about Justin too. He will never leave me. That’s why I know this type of relationship is made for us. I just have to get through this weekend, and see that the same Justin comes home, and I will embrace this much more easily.

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This is probably boring for anyone reading it. We really are just trying to document our true emotions and journey so we can one day go back and see our journey together rough and tough and loving and erotic. Amber is snuggled up with me. Often times we do this together and converse after seeing each other’s thoughts. My thoughts of Nicole, and they are incomplete but what I have learned so far. Nicole in terms of looks is any man’s fantasy, and before I get in trouble here, Amber is my fantasy, and now reality. There is none above her not only in looks but the whole package. Nicole doesn’t realize how sexy she is, but that comes from a different place. She has a sexy sweet naive innocence. But make no mistake she is very mature from her horrific life experiences. I would guess she doesn’t date much if at all, she is scared shitless of men. She got to see and experience what a real loving couple does, how they look at each other. Amber saw that immediately and had a lot of questions from her. She had to feel good because women don’t open up like that unless they are comfortable and she did it around me too not just privately. My take is she isn’t baking cookies for me because she wants to score points, she saw what I was planning for her and it allowed her giving nature to want to come out and show how thankful she is. She has this infectious sweetness to her, and for a woman that had such horrific roots in life, specifically men, it is impressive. She was always happy and cordial when she was here, asking constantly, is this ok. She must have asked Amber 3 times are you sure this is ok? If at any time I’m interfering please tell me and I will walk away. I believe that is genuine, this may be the most welcomed she has ever felt in her life! The dark side, and these thoughts hurt me, I don’t believe anyone in her life sees this Nicole. That can be dangerous to her. This is a part of why I want to be with her. If she trusts me, some, most, or all of this will come out and be released. I don’t think I’m going to get there this weekend, but if I don’t hopefully I will have enough time going forward so it will. Please don’t construe me as some type of Savior for her, I’m not so big and all that, I am humble. What I also am is well resourced. Thanks to hard work, and first and foremost, my grandfather. If I ever dip into that money, and so far I have not, as much as I can will go not to charity or causes that I know nothing about, but to people or animals that in one way or another touched my life. If somehow Nicole becomes my lover, or doesn’t neither are relevant to any of this. If there is some treatment or surgery that restores her ability to get pregnant, she will have it assuming it is what she wants. I would assume the reason why this type of relationship is desirable for her is she can’t get pregnant and doesn’t want to fall in love and get heartbroken. If we did work out, and her ability to get pregnant is restored, I would hope she sets herself free from me and have a life most women desire. That would hurt me emotionally if I was bonded to her, but so rewarding at the same time. Do I think I will have a great time with Nicole this weekend? I’m certain I will because she is just a feel good person to be around, and I will make sure we do. Will the love inducing fairy dust hit me? I have no answer for that. I hope so honestly, but my mind is open and prepared for anything. I also truly hope that Amber comes home and the time she has to get to know Glenn takes her up to the next level with him. Part of this is to learn to turn conventional thinking upside down. Her success and my success means more success for Amber and Justin, so I really love and trust her and wish her weekend leaves her in a better place than before. I do know one thing, when I see her Sunday I am going to jump in her arms, tell her how much I love her, make love to her, and hold her all day long! That more than anything I’m looking forward to!

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Oh my goodness, how do I follow that?????? I won’t even try. He just stripped the jealousy right out of my body. The only thing I can add is Justin, I hope you can see that there will be no other man ever in my life that could ever be as deep in my mind, heart, body, and soul as you! I will love you until my last breath and beyond! I think the day before, and the day after should be two days of a lot of snuggling, kissing, and loving each other. It starts now. I love you so much!!!!!

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One thing this new relationship philosophy does is it awakens you. I have planned kind of like dates with Nicole. Doing so, I realized I don’t “date” Amber enough. You get into a relationship settle down live a happy life. I apologized to Amber. We just don’t really notice. I promised her that ends now. I am going to plan a date with Amber at least once a week. She kind of didn’t think about it, but is thrilled about the idea. This does really help because it forces you to be aware of your primary relationship, which to me will always be a priority.

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It’s so true you really start to communicate and work harder to preserve and make better your primary relationship doing this. If anyone asked me if I would do something like this, I would think they were crazy! Now I love we are doing this. I am looking forward to it and Sunday, when I get my honey back:)

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The one thing we are trying to work out I am not looking forward to with Glenn leaving for 10 days. If Justin is with Nicole how do you balance your primary partner being home alone? How do you react to not seeing her or do you? I don’t want to be a spoiler, and punish Justin and not let him see her. I don’t know how it would be for me. I would certainly learn how it has been like when I spent a night or saw Glenn. I guess I am going to find out

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The most difficult time of all to work out, and it will probably happen at some point is when you or your main partner approaches you saying they need more time with their secondary partner. Prepare to likely have to deal with it. Every relationship has different needs. The other partner is going to immediately become insecure, thinking he is losing his/her partner, and that isn’t the case. You have to remember your partner is in a loving committed relationship and may have greater needs than you. Never should time with a secondary partner exceed that of the first for obvious reasons. This has to be done delicately, and make sure your partner feels secure! He/she hopefully can understand your need and you will have to make him feel secure. You should pay extra attention when with him if you are granted more time. If you need that time and your partner doesn’t understand it could hurt.

So our answer

Justin:

I think I’d get nervous, I think that is a natural reaction, I would want to know what she means by more time? Is she looking for a couple hours, an evening, an overnight? I know if she had that need it would be healthier to agree to it, especially if it was another overnight. I would probably reluctantly say yes, but going forward I’d really need a lot of love and assurance.

Amber:

I would immediately fear I was losing him. I would need a ton of reassurance. I don’t think it would be easy for me to agree. I might ask him if he could do it in baby steps. Once in awhile then gradually a little more until he got to where he needs. I know for me, as a woman, we often are more emotionally attached, and I’d be more apt I think to need another overnight more than him. We kind of found that out already.

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So I asked Justin how he would feel if I spent sat-early to wed morning morning with Glenn because I won’t see him for 10 days, and when he gets back on new year’s night from fri late through Tuesday morning when he gets back? He said I understand some extra time I really do but 4 Days seems like a lot? I said you have to remember I’m going to be with you all of the 10 days in between. He said he is not sure if that is within his boundaries it is almost like you are living with him. Let’s see what happens these next 2 weeks, and we can figure something out ok? So I guess we will hopefully figure something workable out.

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Justin just shared a text from Nicole:

Hi Justin, would it be ok if I stop home after work and change and do my makeup? I kind of don’t want to come over in my work clothes

Justin said you can change when you get here if you want?

Nicole: Thank you, but I would rather not, I kind of want to look better than my work clothes, kind of a girl thing:).

Justin:

Ok no problem, what time should I expect you?

Nicole: I get out at 3, and it is 10 minutes home, so will leave my apartment by 4 so like 4:15. Is that ok? Also after the beach are we going straight to the light show?

Justin: Yes it starts at 7 goes until 8.

Nicole: Ok, Maybe I can change at the beach

Justin: You will look good in anything, I wouldn’t be so worried.

Nicole: If you are going to be with me I want you to feel good that you are with me:)

Justin: I promise I will feel good being with you no matter what you wear

Nicole: That is sweet, thank you. I can’t look as good as Amber, but at lest I can look my best for you.

Justin: we will work it out, don’t stress over it, your a beautiful woman.

Nicole: I always worry about it, I could change in the car if I have to

Justin: lol that would be interesting. I will see when you get here, thanks for letting me know.

Nicole: ok, I’m going to be nervous, but I’m so excited, see you soon. I can’t believe this tomorrow already! Have a good night.

Justin: Thank you and you as well

She is so into him, I told Justin to expect a love struck woman this weekend. He said I’ll just be me and she will be her and we will have a good weekend. That’s my point you being you will set her on fire, you’ll see. I’m going with an open mind, I have no outcome in mind. He’s playing cool, when she comes over with her 34DDs spilling out everywhere, and something tight and sexy he will be drooling over her, we will see who is right. They get home at 8:30, she will have him in bed by 9:30

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Ok so Justin didn’t realize that I’m talking about next weekend already where our plans areFriday late afternoon through Sunday morning. I want to add the rest of Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday early morning home by 7am. So actually that would be 5 nights. That may be too many. I suggested being with him Sunday and most of the day Monday, and have Monday evening til early Wednesday, so days but some time in between. He said under the circumstances yes, but not the same amount when he gets back home, so that is his compromise. It will be hard to go 10 days without him, by far the most time I will not have seen him.

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I know Justin read this:

New relationship energy (or NRE) refers to a state of mind experienced at the beginning of sexual and romantic relationships, typically involving heightened emotional and sexual feelings and excitement. NRE begins with the earliest attractions, may grow into full force when mutuality is established.

I tried to help him understand that I am in that right now. So more time is needed. It doesn’t continue, but at the beginning it is a very real phenomenon. I told him you are going to go through it with Nicole you will see. Then you will understand. Right now you are on the outside looking in, if not this week you will by next week, and I’ll bet you answer differently. Nicole I think already has it for you, if she doesn’t when she wakes up Saturday morning she will be all over you. I sense it in every text she sends you. I will be right again, watch!

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I love that Justin loves making love to me to start our day, especially seems to mean more today because he is going to be with Nicole all weekend. He said he woke up today thinking about it and he said he feels really guilty, because he feels like he is going to be cheating on me. He asked me when you are having sex with Glenn do you ever get that feeling like you are cheating on me? I said maybe you don’t want to hear this, but no. The reason is the first time I slept with Glenn you all but begged me to sleep with him over and over. It became a turn on for me to sleep with Glenn, spend the night with him, move in with him, so I got used to sleeping with him knowing you loved it. So it was way different. He replied, you know that stupid hypnotism still has me with thoughts out of the blue wanting you to move in with Glenn, but the difference is the voice of reason inside takes over and realized quickly that isn’t what I want. When the hypnosis is in effect you don’t really feel different, that voice of reason somehow disappears and you your mind seems to dwell on yes you have to move in with him, I need to have an affair with you, and you believe it to be true and never doubt it, so weird. I know I want to do this, but I’m worried I will feel so guilty after this weekend. I’m trying to adjust my mind and just have a good time or She will not have a good time. I told him there is no cheating, you know, I am nervous too, but I’m supporting you so don’t feel guilty. I know, the big change and challenge here for me is this new relationship style, which I totally believe in goes against my natural instincts. I know you wanted to be with Glenn for an added time because you won’t see him for quite awhile, my natural instincts say no, but our new relationship venture says I should be sensitive to your needs. Maybe because I’m not used to this yet it is hard for me to accept you with him for 5 days. I think if we have been doing this longer I would be more secure and I would love for you to have that time, just right now it is hard. I asked him let’s suppose you have a great time with Nicole and she moves your emotions, do you think that experience would help you understand why I need that time with Glenn? He said he is not sure, but I would imagine it might make me more receptive to it.

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Justin got a text from Nicole this morning. She said she did some searching on the type of relationship that me and him have, and the others that are more or less invited in. She said I just want you to know I understand my place in your relationship with Amber. I just want you to know I am perfectly ok with it, in fact it fits how And why I put an ad in for it. I decided I don’t want to be in a full relationship with a man, I have some reasons, some of which you know, others you don’t but too personal right now. I really have decided a long time ago that I wanted to be a “mistress” so to speak. With you and Amber it is no secret, I don’t have to hide and hurt anyone. That makes it even better. I’m not sure what tomorrow brings. I’m just great full for today. I will never get in the way of you and Amber no matter what happens be sure of that. If things somehow work out, I would love a life like that, no jealousy on my part ever, and no trying to pull you away from Amber. I love both of you for the experience we shared, and the love between you is remarkable.

Wow talk about the perfect partner. She actually made me feel better about Justin being with her. It appears if they connect he will never have to look for another partner. Probably as ideal as you could ever hope for. Justin just realized she sent this before work, he just checked his phone. Justin said now I am sure what you said about her inability to get pregnant has altered her course in relationships. She doesn’t want to fall in love with someone and have to tell them she can never have his baby. Shit, that is just so wrong. It obviously is very personal. Amber do you realize the trust and comfort she had with you in one day that she could share that with you? I don’t think you realize that she is dying inside to talk about that with someone, I have to become that guy! I’m not sure how long it will take but I will be that guy, and if she can be helped I don’t care what it costs I will help her, of course only if she wants the help and can accept it. Justin text her back immediately so she isn’t stressing that she bared her soul and no response can be considered negative. He basically said Nicole, thank you for pouring your heart out. I love when someone can tell someone tender things as you have. Regardless of what happens this weekend, and I promise we will have a great time, you will always have a place in our lives. You have a really beautiful soul within you, and there is always a place in our lives for you. She text back you just made me tear up have to get busy, can’t wait to see you!

He’s going to fall hard and fast for her no matter what he thinks, she speaks “Justin” makes me a bit nervous though.

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Justin and I agreed on the importance of texting sessions while we are away from each other. Limit it to 10 minutes 1 time tonight, and twice on Saturday, and 1 time Sunday morning. I told her Nicole will leave at noon, but just to be on the safe side, she shouldn’t get home until 12:30, because when she gets home He wants it to be just me and her. I totally agree. If you send a text and there is no reply, don’t panic, you don’t know what the other is doing at that moment. Once the other gets a chance to read the text, try to set up a specific 20 minutes to text at a specific time. The call must strictly be about me and Justin, not did you sleep with him/her? How many times? Did you say I love you? None of that. Those questions and any that need or want to be asked are for when you are both together. Be prepared that there might be a question or two that will be really hard to answer, and when you answer reassure your partner there is nothing to worry about, and make sure partner security is high. Never leave a question unanswered no matter how difficult it is to answer, or your security and trust will take a hit and you will find yourself in troubled waters. The most important of all is no matter what, no matter how hard it may seem NEVER LIE or your relationship may never recover, or never be the same. If you can’t be painfully honest don’t even try this, you will wipe out your relationship. Sensitivities will be high, make sure you are sensitive to your partners needs, and at the same time always negotiate your boundaries. If all this is done properly, your relationship will experience its own new relationship energy. Once you embrace each other’s relationship within another committed relationship your own relationship will have more admiration, trust, and respect. Trust, and honesty have to lead the way.

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Getting so nervous. Lots of hopes and fears and can’t waits:

Fears:

Justin gets overcome for Nicole
He comes home not as into me

Hopes:

This takes Glenn and me to a broader and higher relationship not just meeting for sex
Justin after being with Nicole understands why I need more time with Glenn

Cant wait:

To see Justin on Sunday
A few days with Glenn.
Hopefully 5 days next week

Almost time to get ready, already packed, Justin says I have enough clothes for a month!

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One more hope:

This raises our relationship to new heights
We both learn to love the happiness And love each of us has for each other’s partners

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The best way I can describe this weekend is Amber is in the pool up to her waist, and it feels good. This weekend she is diving all the way in. For me I have my foot in the water with Nicole. I love how it feels so far. This weekend I’m diving in and want to see how it feels.

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This truly seems surreal. Amber is out and probably in bed right now, and in 20 minutes or so I have Nicole coming over and will at some point likely doing the same. I really hope this all works out because if it does we will hit a higher level in our relationship. . I think we both want it so much we will always do the right thing as much as we can. I’m actually a bit nervous just sitting here waiting. I’m going to do everything I can so we have a good time at the very least. Starting from a good spot, I really do like her. Wish me and us luck. Back here sometime late Sunday. Great for a beach sunset here high 70s not a cloud in the sky.