Moderator: EMG
"Yeah, but this is too good to pass up. Let me feel them for a bit. "she said.
She asked " i can grab your breasts and ass, for as long as i want, and you won't stop me?"
I don t feel nothing. I am totally numb. I am a heterosexual woman
Not having the willpower nor the desire to resist. Why? It was almost an out-of-body experience, watching myself allowing her hands to crawl over me.
keybounce wrote:I don't know about hypnosis, but looking at this, I see the following:
1. She started with compliments, and showing respect, getting you to lower your guard, and painting a "lady on a pedestal" image.
2: In the middle of this, she tried to give you re-assurance about masking/safety, and you actually responded with "Me too" -- which tells your brain a sense of "Same tribe". That's actually going to lower your resistance to something that comes later.
3. This was followed immediately by an offer of help/assistance, that you accepted. Basically, you've now told your brain that this person is helpful/trusted.
4. You got more flattery; sounds like a lot of it. Now your brain is entering confusion state.
5. She then went with seriously unexpected touch, which probably had the same PGO spike of instant inductions because it was so unexpected.
6. She did not stop, so suddenly you were getting physical pleasure sensations. This has nothing to do with being hetero/homo; this is just plain tactile simulation that reaches your threshold. Again, it's all unexpected, so it's continuing to be brain confusion.
At this point, you have created a sense of trust, similar to the "yes-set" effect; a sense of confusion; a PGO spike; a strong tactile pleasure factor."Yeah, but this is too good to pass up. Let me feel them for a bit. "she said.
Agreeing with you, and then a suggestion to let it continue. This line seems to be the push-over / tripping point. Prior to this, you started to show resistance to her actions. After this, you have none.
I am definitely a beginner studying conversational hypnosis, but this looks like it. That's not to say it was intentional; this could just be someone's personal fetish.
This is followed by instructions, that you comply with; more of the same; etc.She asked " i can grab your breasts and ass, for as long as i want, and you won't stop me?"
That's not just a question. That's about as classic of a hypnotic suggetion as you can get. Note the word order, and note what your mental state was at this point.I don t feel nothing. I am totally numb. I am a heterosexual woman
This seems to be your attempt to "survive" past this, for lack of any other wording. Basically, you are distancing "you" from your body. But, my understanding is that this is actually just going deeper into trance -- the separating "you" from "your body" is a classic induction/deepening technique, and I've seen hypnotists who go "May I borrow that hand", pointing to a person's off-hand, as a way to confuse the brain and disassociate the body.Not having the willpower nor the desire to resist. Why? It was almost an out-of-body experience, watching myself allowing her hands to crawl over me.
Nothing to do with will power. Your brain was in a state of confusion; your body was in a state of "This is desirable". Calling it an "out of body experience, watching yourself" is a really good indication that you were in a trance.
So yea, you were in a trance, and she was giving you suggestions. That's hypnosis.
How would you deal with this person in the future? Well, basically, be aware of this now. Be willing to push her away if she touches you. Use the word "No". Tell yourself that she is not your tribe, not trusted.
keybounce wrote:I don't know about hypnosis, but looking at this, I see the following:
1. She started with compliments, and showing respect, getting you to lower your guard, and painting a "lady on a pedestal" image.
2: In the middle of this, she tried to give you re-assurance about masking/safety, and you actually responded with "Me too" -- which tells your brain a sense of "Same tribe". That's actually going to lower your resistance to something that comes later.
3. This was followed immediately by an offer of help/assistance, that you accepted. Basically, you've now told your brain that this person is helpful/trusted.
4. You got more flattery; sounds like a lot of it. Now your brain is entering confusion state.
5. She then went with seriously unexpected touch, which probably had the same PGO spike of instant inductions because it was so unexpected.
6. She did not stop, so suddenly you were getting physical pleasure sensations. This has nothing to do with being hetero/homo; this is just plain tactile simulation that reaches your threshold. Again, it's all unexpected, so it's continuing to be brain confusion.
At this point, you have created a sense of trust, similar to the "yes-set" effect; a sense of confusion; a PGO spike; a strong tactile pleasure factor."Yeah, but this is too good to pass up. Let me feel them for a bit. "she said.
Agreeing with you, and then a suggestion to let it continue. This line seems to be the push-over / tripping point. Prior to this, you started to show resistance to her actions. After this, you have none.
I am definitely a beginner studying conversational hypnosis, but this looks like it. That's not to say it was intentional; this could just be someone's personal fetish.
This is followed by instructions, that you comply with; more of the same; etc.She asked " i can grab your breasts and ass, for as long as i want, and you won't stop me?"
That's not just a question. That's about as classic of a hypnotic suggetion as you can get. Note the word order, and note what your mental state was at this point.I don t feel nothing. I am totally numb. I am a heterosexual woman
This seems to be your attempt to "survive" past this, for lack of any other wording. Basically, you are distancing "you" from your body. But, my understanding is that this is actually just going deeper into trance -- the separating "you" from "your body" is a classic induction/deepening technique, and I've seen hypnotists who go "May I borrow that hand", pointing to a person's off-hand, as a way to confuse the brain and disassociate the body.Not having the willpower nor the desire to resist. Why? It was almost an out-of-body experience, watching myself allowing her hands to crawl over me.
Nothing to do with will power. Your brain was in a state of confusion; your body was in a state of "This is desirable". Calling it an "out of body experience, watching yourself" is a really good indication that you were in a trance.
So yea, you were in a trance, and she was giving you suggestions. That's hypnosis.
How would you deal with this person in the future? Well, basically, be aware of this now. Be willing to push her away if she touches you. Use the word "No". Tell yourself that she is not your tribe, not trusted.
grover27 wrote:This is a different type of posting for these parts. Welcome to the WMM forums and thank you for sharing your story and issue. I found your story fascinating and am sorry to say that I am a guy that is attracted to tall curvy women, so I'm sure I enjoyed your story even more because of the visuals. I am sorry that this happened to you, as I am sure it is haunting your mind - both what happened and how you could have let it happen. First, it's not your fault, so don't beat yourself up over it. Second, I like to look at these moments as little tests in life that we can learn and grow from and become stronger people. Life is about constantly improving as a person - this experience will definitely serve as a lesson in your life and perhaps strengthen you for a bigger and more serious challenge.
I think the other poster pretty damn nailed the hypno influence of what happened. So I definitely concur with that.
I want to explore a little more though.
A few things. First, this woman is definitely "different". I've met strange people like this in my life (most happen to be women, but some men) and they are just unusual creatures that live life by a very different set of rules. Was she versed in hypnotism and trying to hypnotize you or was she just so outside of society norms that you were taken aback and didn't know how to react? I suspect the latter, but it works the same way in terms of confusing you and throwing you off your game. A similar thing (well not exactly) happened to me and my wife this weekend when a homeless man approached us and worked his game to get some money. When you are hit with things that you don't expect, they can serve to put you in a bit of a trance.
You call her a pale ugly short woman (or forms of that) throughout your story. You clearly identify her in this very negative way. Is it possible that you felt sorry for her in some subconcious way? Almost like a guilt. "White privilege" is the current buzzword and people are certainly going out of their way to prove it doesn't apply to them. Do you perhaps have sexy tall woman privilege guilt issues that made you feel like you owe it to this ugly woman to give her a little thrill or give her her way? After all, was it really hurting you? and it was clearly making her day, right? Don't you owe her that much for the great gift you have been given with your looks while she has been cursed with being short, pale and ugly? Those are rhetorical questions, but think about whether you might relate to that.
I think you need to reflect on this pretty deeply. Take some time to yourself to almost meditate on it and think about what you wish you would have done and then play that scene over again and again in your mind the way that you would have wanted it to go down. Then be prepared with that new scene in your head so that you can react the "right" way the next time you see her. Perhaps also consider reading this book: https://www.amazon.com/When-Say-No-Feel ... 0553263900
Build up your strength now so you are ready for your next encounter. You owe her nothing and you certainly shouldn't let her touch you again.
Good luck!
When I go out in public guys start talking to me and subtly try to ask me out. I have trouble being mean so i cant get them to leave me alone. I end up getting stressed by it.
It's just the fact that she took control of me, she did whatever she wanted to me . She just took what she wanted.
... because she is a small older woman she thinks i will let her get away with it, and i did. I strongly suspect that i am targeted by this woman, maybe she is seething with envy of me and my life, and she wants to publicly dominate me.
I am avoiding her. But she works at the bookstore next door. ... I don’t want to go to my own store because of this weird touchy feely woman.
I like to think I'd do something more assertive if it happened again but realistically this small pale hands on woman probably will get away with touching me and groping me.
I do feel a little sorry for her. But why? I am big woman. I am 5 ft 11 and being well endowed well built and curvy always on high heels makes me HUGE! But I love my height and my curvy stature.
keybounce wrote:I'm going to address this differently. I hope that this will help you.
Let me be clear here: I'm looking to put you in a trance and do some hypnosis on you now. If you don't want that, skip to the next message.
*WAIT*
Were you about to skip to the next message?
Then: GOOD.
That means you just said, "I don't want to be hypnotized".
Do you see what I did? Ok, here it is again:
I gave you notice that I was going to hypnotize you, and told you what to do to not be hypnotized. And you could choose that.
What happens when this lady comes up to you next time? Lets say you can tell when she is trying to do something that would put you in trance. You can say "No". Just like you did there.
You can choose to not be in trance.
So lets start with the second part. The "Here's what you do if you want to avoid trance". This lady presumably will want to touch you, will say things to confuse you, will give your brain a "What's going on???" spike, and then rely on physical, sensual touch to keep your brain in overload.
So lets look at interrupting that.
You can push her arm away, and say "no".
You can recognize confusion, and say to yourself, "She is not trusted".
You can *practice* in your mind what she might do so that you do not have the confusion when it happens (NB: this is a two-sided sword -- it solves one problem but opens another, see below).
And you can, now that you have been through "overload" and know what it feels like, recognize it and tell yourself "The next time this happens, I will say
'no' and walk away".
That "practice" that I mentioned before? It's simple imagination. Imagine what she might do, and how you would react.
The "good" of this: It removes the confusion by teaching your brain what to expect next.
The "bad" of this: It teaches your brain what to expect next.
To make this work, and work *for* you, and not against you, your imagination has to include 1, she touches you, 2, you recognize that the touch has a sensation, and 3, you respond with no.
She touches you -- that's an external that you have no control over.
The touch has a sensation -- Drop it from a sense of sensuality triggering your pleasure center, to a plain dull fact of your body. Remove the pleasure center activity in response to the touch. "Depleasure" the experience.
When you can imagine the touch happening without any pleasure associated with it, that's the point of success.
So that's what to do to avoid being tranced/deepened. Now, lets look at recognizing the induction in the first place, so you can see "Hey, this is what I don't want".
In some sense, this is a big question. There are many ways to do conversational hypnosis. We haven't seen anything that indicates (yet) that this person is maliciously and knowingly trying to hypnotize you. They could just have a fetish, they could have a crush for some reason, etc; they might have just learned that behavior like this just works because most people don't have any idea how to respond.
So one option is just "I'm sorry, I don't want to talk to you" every time they try to come up to you. Just refuse to listen to them. Carry out your life normally, just exclude them from it.
That's the simplest way.
Another way? Well, anything else means that you'll have to listen to them, and talk to them. But you have to remember that you don't trust them. Maybe this is something you can't really do.
I'm looking over your posts. Please tell me if anything here is wrong. Please do not just assume that what I am saying here is fact. What I am saying here is observation. This is accurate observation, but it is up to you to tell if it is fact or not.
IMPORTANT: Do not lie to yourself here. You might see things here that are true that you do not want to acknowledge. If you want to prevent someone from hypnotizing you like that, you need to be able to recognize truth as opposed to a lie you want to believe.
Here are my observations. Again, tell me if I'm wrong. Or, tell me if what I'm saying is both true and something you don't want to be true. Or, tell me if it's true and you are OK with it.
1. You are constantly talking about your body and your boobs/chest. The impression I get is that your self-image is significantly defined by your body shape.
2. You made it clear that you regarded any touch as a sexual advance. (NB: Note that when this lady touched you, your body wanted to both treat it as a sexual thing, and a "I'm not that type" non-sexual thing. I think this is the source of the confusion factor in your brain -- it was coming to both opposing conclusions at the same time, and you had nothing to resolve that confusion with.)
Initially, I think this is what you need to change -- regard touch as not inherently sexual in nature.
3. You talk about her body shape, and her actions as a groper, as if this is all that defines her.
4. You are constantly talking about, and paying attention to, her controlling you. What you pay attention to will persist; as long as you are constantly focusing on being controlled, that's what's expected. You have to move past the thoughts of being controlled.When I go out in public guys start talking to me and subtly try to ask me out. I have trouble being mean so i cant get them to leave me alone. I end up getting stressed by it.
So don't be mean, just say "No". "I'm not interested". "Sorry, I'm married". "Can you make a friend before you make a pass?". "I don't know you, and my husband does not know you". "If you only see a body, you insult me and everything else about me". Etc. These are not mean (well, that last one maybe).
Then, we see you describing the other lady. Again, you are constantly referring to her body description. This gets back to "Self image is based on body shape".
Next message / your response:
Again, body shape, and reference to "groper". So let me ask you:
Who are you if you are not your body shape?
What are you if you are not your body shape? (NB: "what", not "who")
Who are you if you are not your husband's wife?
Who are you if you are not this person's target?
What are you if you are not being touched?
What are you if you are not afraid of touch?
When you can get an answer for who you are that has nothing to do with body, sensuality, touch, etc, then you have something to rely on, to fall back to, to avoid confusion brain lock.It's just the fact that she took control of me, she did whatever she wanted to me . She just took what she wanted.
Yes. And?
She did what she wanted. You were in a state of confusion, and did not know what next.
Now you can say "Next time this happens, this is what happens next". Focus on what touch *newly* means to you, if it does not mean sex; what and who you are after understanding what you are not. You have to make these choices.... because she is a small older woman she thinks i will let her get away with it, and i did. I strongly suspect that i am targeted by this woman, maybe she is seething with envy of me and my life, and she wants to publicly dominate me.
Never ascribe to malice what can be explained by ... Well, just about anything else.
She thinks you will let her? You did let her. That does not mean you need to let her next time. The future is not defined by past actions, but by choices made reviewing past actions.I am avoiding her. But she works at the bookstore next door. ... I don’t want to go to my own store because of this weird touchy feely woman.
Avoidance is probably not the answer, just because you cannot get 100% success here. As you said, she's the next door business. So relying on abstinence is no more successful here than for teenagers. Confront and deal with the situation.I like to think I'd do something more assertive if it happened again but realistically this small pale hands on woman probably will get away with touching me and groping me.
"No." "Please stop touching me", and push her arm with your arm (NB: Don't grab with your hand. There are too many ways for someone with basic martial arts/self defense training to basically control where your arm goes once your hand grabs them like that. Aim to use your wrist to push away.)
And "If you do not stop, I will call the police". And follow up. Make that call. Recognize that they won't come immediately, and might not come for two or three calls. But you can ask to make a statement over the phone, and it may take time, it will happen.
The good news: Your brain will not be in confusion, and you won't go in trance like that.
When she tries this, you will tell her no, and prepare to call the police, as often as it takes until something happens.
---I do feel a little sorry for her. But why? I am big woman. I am 5 ft 11 and being well endowed well built and curvy always on high heels makes me HUGE! But I love my height and my curvy stature.
This is why. You value X, you have X, she does not, so she is not valued.
keybounce wrote:I'm going to address this differently. I hope that this will help you.
Let me be clear here: I'm looking to put you in a trance and do some hypnosis on you now. If you don't want that, skip to the next message.
*WAIT*
Were you about to skip to the next message?
Then: GOOD.
That means you just said, "I don't want to be hypnotized".
Do you see what I did? Ok, here it is again:
I gave you notice that I was going to hypnotize you, and told you what to do to not be hypnotized. And you could choose that.
What happens when this lady comes up to you next time? Lets say you can tell when she is trying to do something that would put you in trance. You can say "No". Just like you did there.
You can choose to not be in trance.
So lets start with the second part. The "Here's what you do if you want to avoid trance". This lady presumably will want to touch you, will say things to confuse you, will give your brain a "What's going on???" spike, and then rely on physical, sensual touch to keep your brain in overload.
So lets look at interrupting that.
You can push her arm away, and say "no".
You can recognize confusion, and say to yourself, "She is not trusted".
You can *practice* in your mind what she might do so that you do not have the confusion when it happens (NB: this is a two-sided sword -- it solves one problem but opens another, see below).
And you can, now that you have been through "overload" and know what it feels like, recognize it and tell yourself "The next time this happens, I will say
'no' and walk away".
That "practice" that I mentioned before? It's simple imagination. Imagine what she might do, and how you would react.
The "good" of this: It removes the confusion by teaching your brain what to expect next.
The "bad" of this: It teaches your brain what to expect next.
To make this work, and work *for* you, and not against you, your imagination has to include 1, she touches you, 2, you recognize that the touch has a sensation, and 3, you respond with no.
She touches you -- that's an external that you have no control over.
The touch has a sensation -- Drop it from a sense of sensuality triggering your pleasure center, to a plain dull fact of your body. Remove the pleasure center activity in response to the touch. "Depleasure" the experience.
When you can imagine the touch happening without any pleasure associated with it, that's the point of success.
So that's what to do to avoid being tranced/deepened. Now, lets look at recognizing the induction in the first place, so you can see "Hey, this is what I don't want".
In some sense, this is a big question. There are many ways to do conversational hypnosis. We haven't seen anything that indicates (yet) that this person is maliciously and knowingly trying to hypnotize you. They could just have a fetish, they could have a crush for some reason, etc; they might have just learned that behavior like this just works because most people don't have any idea how to respond.
So one option is just "I'm sorry, I don't want to talk to you" every time they try to come up to you. Just refuse to listen to them. Carry out your life normally, just exclude them from it.
That's the simplest way.
Another way? Well, anything else means that you'll have to listen to them, and talk to them. But you have to remember that you don't trust them. Maybe this is something you can't really do.
I'm looking over your posts. Please tell me if anything here is wrong. Please do not just assume that what I am saying here is fact. What I am saying here is observation. This is accurate observation, but it is up to you to tell if it is fact or not.
IMPORTANT: Do not lie to yourself here. You might see things here that are true that you do not want to acknowledge. If you want to prevent someone from hypnotizing you like that, you need to be able to recognize truth as opposed to a lie you want to believe.
Here are my observations. Again, tell me if I'm wrong. Or, tell me if what I'm saying is both true and something you don't want to be true. Or, tell me if it's true and you are OK with it.
1. You are constantly talking about your body and your boobs/chest. The impression I get is that your self-image is significantly defined by your body shape.
2. You made it clear that you regarded any touch as a sexual advance. (NB: Note that when this lady touched you, your body wanted to both treat it as a sexual thing, and a "I'm not that type" non-sexual thing. I think this is the source of the confusion factor in your brain -- it was coming to both opposing conclusions at the same time, and you had nothing to resolve that confusion with.)
Initially, I think this is what you need to change -- regard touch as not inherently sexual in nature.
3. You talk about her body shape, and her actions as a groper, as if this is all that defines her.
4. You are constantly talking about, and paying attention to, her controlling you. What you pay attention to will persist; as long as you are constantly focusing on being controlled, that's what's expected. You have to move past the thoughts of being controlled.When I go out in public guys start talking to me and subtly try to ask me out. I have trouble being mean so i cant get them to leave me alone. I end up getting stressed by it.
So don't be mean, just say "No". "I'm not interested". "Sorry, I'm married". "Can you make a friend before you make a pass?". "I don't know you, and my husband does not know you". "If you only see a body, you insult me and everything else about me". Etc. These are not mean (well, that last one maybe).
Then, we see you describing the other lady. Again, you are constantly referring to her body description. This gets back to "Self image is based on body shape".
Next message / your response:
Again, body shape, and reference to "groper". So let me ask you:
Who are you if you are not your body shape?
What are you if you are not your body shape? (NB: "what", not "who")
Who are you if you are not your husband's wife?
Who are you if you are not this person's target?
What are you if you are not being touched?
What are you if you are not afraid of touch?
When you can get an answer for who you are that has nothing to do with body, sensuality, touch, etc, then you have something to rely on, to fall back to, to avoid confusion brain lock.It's just the fact that she took control of me, she did whatever she wanted to me . She just took what she wanted.
Yes. And?
She did what she wanted. You were in a state of confusion, and did not know what next.
Now you can say "Next time this happens, this is what happens next". Focus on what touch *newly* means to you, if it does not mean sex; what and who you are after understanding what you are not. You have to make these choices.... because she is a small older woman she thinks i will let her get away with it, and i did. I strongly suspect that i am targeted by this woman, maybe she is seething with envy of me and my life, and she wants to publicly dominate me.
Never ascribe to malice what can be explained by ... Well, just about anything else.
She thinks you will let her? You did let her. That does not mean you need to let her next time. The future is not defined by past actions, but by choices made reviewing past actions.I am avoiding her. But she works at the bookstore next door. ... I don’t want to go to my own store because of this weird touchy feely woman.
Avoidance is probably not the answer, just because you cannot get 100% success here. As you said, she's the next door business. So relying on abstinence is no more successful here than for teenagers. Confront and deal with the situation.I like to think I'd do something more assertive if it happened again but realistically this small pale hands on woman probably will get away with touching me and groping me.
"No." "Please stop touching me", and push her arm with your arm (NB: Don't grab with your hand. There are too many ways for someone with basic martial arts/self defense training to basically control where your arm goes once your hand grabs them like that. Aim to use your wrist to push away.)
And "If you do not stop, I will call the police". And follow up. Make that call. Recognize that they won't come immediately, and might not come for two or three calls. But you can ask to make a statement over the phone, and it may take time, it will happen.
The good news: Your brain will not be in confusion, and you won't go in trance like that.
When she tries this, you will tell her no, and prepare to call the police, as often as it takes until something happens.
---I do feel a little sorry for her. But why? I am big woman. I am 5 ft 11 and being well endowed well built and curvy always on high heels makes me HUGE! But I love my height and my curvy stature.
This is why. You value X, you have X, she does not, so she is not valued.
grover27 wrote:I see you are concerned about your sexuality here. I can assure you that this incident does not make you homosexual. Far from it. Just like a guy wanting to be pegged by a woman doesn't make him homosexual. You are only homosexual if you have an attraction to the same sex and not the opposite sex. That is clearly not the case with you. Even if you were bisexual, you have not discovered that side of yourself and you certainly aren't going to discover it in the hands of this woman. This woman is purely a weird predator who molested you. What she did is against the law. It's an interesting question regarding whether she used covert hypnotism on purpose against you or if her actions just had the same effect, but regardless, she molested you.
Now, if you are still struggling with this, perhaps what you are struggling with is a new found pleasure of being submissive. You've said nothing about your sex life but if you have always felt that because you are an Amazon woman that you are expected to be more dominant, then perhaps you for the first time have been taken back by the pleasures of submission. If that is the case, then there are much safer ways to discover submission. Play with some of the hypno tracks on this site for example, or let your husband know that you want him to be more dominant and you want to role play as sexually submissive. I for one strive to be an alpha male in my daily life but I again and again fall into the need to experience the pleasure of being submissive. They have a term "subspace" which means you go into a trance like state when you truly submit. It's freeing and peaceful and pleasurable, and perhaps that is what you experienced. That said, if my wife ever said she wanted me to submit to me and experience pure dominance, I would be all over that in a heartbeat too.
Regardless, explore it with someone you trust and tell this unwelcomed molester to fuck off.
grover27 wrote:I agree that keybounce had a really good response and I enjoyed reading it. This is a man that has a really good understanding of hypnosis.
As for your husband, I am really sorry to hear this. You certainly deserve to have a man that trusts you and is confident in himself such that he is not intimidated by other men. The irony is that type of behavior is exactly what will eventually drive you away - not the attention of other men. I don't have any good advice for you about him because that is something that he needs to figure out himself. I know many guys can be like this and it's really a shame that their own self-esteem and jealousy issues can hurt a marriage so much. You should be able to dress as you wish and go out as you wish and trust in him to be able to reveal what happened to you without fear of repercussion. I hope that he can figure his shit out sometime soon for your sake.
As a side note, I appreciate the fact that you have posted pictures of yourself on here, as it is always nice to have visuals and you are certainly a beautiful woman with a beautiful body - as you of course already know.
I don't like being told what to do or wear as I'm not a child.
He isn't really the manipulatuve/abusive type
I'm not allowed to have any guy friends. My husband doesn't allow me to talk to other guys but he talk to other women.
If I want to go out with my friends, he gets upset. His argument is "But I never go Friday nights with my friends, why are you going with your friends? You aren't even going with your friends. You are probably going with some guy. You used to not go out before. What has changed? Do you not love me anymore? Is there someone else now?"
He isn't really the manipulatuve
his jealousy is ruining our marriage.
I am so confused about what happened to me! Whether or not it is my fault or not! I feel so ashamed. I'm just lost. Should I even be upset? I was SO embarrassed. It was very frustrating. I don’t think I can discuss this verbally with anyone. I can't even talk to my husband about this. I feel embarrassed and ashamed of myself. I'm confused and my mind doesn't stop.
I'm not allowed to have any guy friends.
If I want to go out with my friends, he gets upset.
keybounce wrote:Hoo boy. This is a biggie.I don't like being told what to do or wear as I'm not a child.
...He isn't really the manipulatuve/abusive type
...I'm not allowed to have any guy friends. My husband doesn't allow me to talk to other guys but he talk to other women.If I want to go out with my friends, he gets upset. His argument is "But I never go Friday nights with my friends, why are you going with your friends? You aren't even going with your friends. You are probably going with some guy. You used to not go out before. What has changed? Do you not love me anymore? Is there someone else now?"
He isn't really the manipulatuvehis jealousy is ruining our marriage.
I am out of my knowledge here, so I will say this: GET MARRIAGE COUNSELING!
From my experience with friends who had relationships like this: it is abusive. These sorts of "I will control you" along with this "But I don't like it" is a powderkeg waiting to explode.
It would be one thing if you liked/enjoyed letting him drive your life. That's fine, more of a classic dom/sub relationship.
But this?
You don't have to answer this question at all. You may ignore this.
what do you love about him?
Now, getting back to the situation at work:I am so confused about what happened to me! Whether or not it is my fault or not! I feel so ashamed. I'm just lost. Should I even be upset? I was SO embarrassed. It was very frustrating. I don’t think I can discuss this verbally with anyone. I can't even talk to my husband about this. I feel embarrassed and ashamed of myself. I'm confused and my mind doesn't stop.
First, this confusion is going to keep giving her inroads into trancing you. If you cannot discuss it with your husband, you need to discuss it with someone else. You might need to go to a trained therapist next.
There is one serious problem in your relationship that I see showing up here.I'm not allowed to have any guy friends.
So the only friends you can have are female, and this female is acting friendly to you.
Does that sum it up?
Are you confused because someone is trying to be "friendly", that "friendly" comes with a sense of "What was that?", and you just don't know how to deal with simultaneously friend and not-friend? Combined with a lack of friends otherwise?If I want to go out with my friends, he gets upset.
And here's someone that can be a friend that he won't find out about? Not on your phone, not on your facebook, the first case of someone he won't know about?
There is a TON going on here. I am way out of my knowledge zone, so: When in doubt, refer out. Get help from someone trained with this, and that's not me.
What I see: Your husband is being massively controlling and restrictive of you. You don't like that. You don't have friends, are not allowed to have friends, and suddenly you can't fit this new person into the very few tiny boxes you are allowed to have.
And that seems to be the cause of the confusion.
Get Help.
louisa wrote:I followed your advice, but it was a disaster. Yesterday i was standing in the middle of my store. ... woman walked into my store. I decided to ignore her, so i turned my back on her.
She said hi to my employees ,started kinda circling the store, but she stopped behind me. I jumped a little as i felt her hands slide around my hips from behind.
<5 sentences, including some flattery> she said as her hands rubbed my stomach.
I gasped as her hands slid up and cupped my breasts. I was about to protest when this small pale woman commented that my blouse is too small. I winced as she gave my breasts a squeeze. She commented it was around my breasts that the blouse was the tightest.
<more compliments and touch>
"That is a part of my brassiere. I always prefer my blouses to be tucked in. It makes the look neater" i replied.
"Okay that is enough," i said at last, reaching up and prying her hands off my bust.
This small pale woman seemed a little disappointed as she moved out from behind me .
Her creepy gaze rolled over my chest.
<3 more sentences complementing your large chest>
"the buttons are almost threatening to pop free."" she pointed out, stepping right in front of me.
<More touch, going to the buttons of your blouse>
"these buttons are going to pop free."she said as her finger traced the button stand of my blouse. I shyly wrapped my right arm across my chest, so she stopped touching the buttons of my blouse.
"Wait a moment, " the small pale woman said , once again stepped forward. "Let me check something."
I just stood there in bewilderment as she pulled my arm away from my breasts. She reached out with her both hands and cupped and squeezed my breasts.
"Is this really necessary?" I asked as she squeezed my boobs , giving them a good feel.
<more communication, and evidence of confusion>
"I m very fond of my personal space. Stop." I protested at last
... I jumped in shock. ... but she kept rubbing and squeezing my ass with her both hands. So i just stood there like paralyzed, ... she finally removed her hands from my ass. ... I was flustered and confused, i needed some fresh air, ... small woman followed me ... started rubbing up and down ...
"You are not arrogant Louisa.
--> You are letting me to touch you. <--
You are a good woman.
-- snip --
Just let me.
-- snip --
Also my coat was over my shoulders(balancing a coat on your shoulders isn’t easy. Your shoulders must remain lifted, keeping the luxe fabric from slipping off and down your back.)
"...it is buttoned up to the top but the buttons are almost threatening to pop free. " The small pale bookstore clerk said with a great enthusiasm. .
keybounce wrote:Your intention when interacting with her must include that she is not permitted, not allowed, to touch you.
Your intention must include that you are in charge, that she must listen to you when you say "No. Stop. Leave".
Your intention must include being able to say, "Leave my store."
And you must have permission to say "Do not come back."
Give yourself permission to say, "Stop. Leave my store. Do not come back. You are not welcome. You are prohibited."louisa wrote:I followed your advice, but it was a disaster. Yesterday i was standing in the middle of my store. ... woman walked into my store. I decided to ignore her, so i turned my back on her.
Ignoring her is not the goal. Keeping her from doing this to you is.
Say, "I want you to leave my body alone. Do not touch me". No "please". Nothing implying requesting or anything about her having choice.
Imagine her showing up. Visualize it. Use a repeat of yesterday, or imagine it new. Now, imagine as she walks towards you, see yourself telling her, "I want you to leave my body alone. Do not touch me."
If you want her out of your life entirely, say something stronger. Make it up, and say it with intent. Your intent is 100% critical here.She said hi to my employees ,started kinda circling the store, but she stopped behind me. I jumped a little as i felt her hands slide around my hips from behind.
<5 sentences, including some flattery> she said as her hands rubbed my stomach.
I gasped as her hands slid up and cupped my breasts. I was about to protest when this small pale woman commented that my blouse is too small. I winced as she gave my breasts a squeeze. She commented it was around my breasts that the blouse was the tightest.
First, you were startled at her touch, and she was talking. She got 5 sentences in, gave you some flattery, while touching/startling you, and then moved up -- triggering a body shock.
This sounds like another PGO-spike type of effect.
As you were about to say something, she interrupts you with another sentence, this time -- you've mentioned that you value your large chest, and she is giving you a compliment. Followed by yet another body shock. Then another compliment.
---
Say, "I have told you to not touch me". Not "I have asked you". "I have told you". Make it clear that she does not have permission.
Make sure that *YOU KNOW THAT SHE DOES NOT HAVE PERMISSION*.
Again, visualize: Either imagine a repeat of this scene, or a new scene, and see yourself *INTERRUPT HER*, telling her that she does not have permission, that you *have told her this is not allowed*.
Again, See Your Intention. No matter what happens, this behavior of hers is not acceptable, not allowed.
Do not let her interrupt you.
You are in charge.
Tell her that this is not allowed.<more compliments and touch>
"That is a part of my brassiere. I always prefer my blouses to be tucked in. It makes the look neater" i replied.
I want you to think back to this moment.
I want you to step back, in your mind, from the scene.
I want you to imagine that you are watching this play out. That it is not "you, looking at her doing this", but that you are a third party, looking at those two people over there interacting.
Can you visualize that for me? Can you see those two ladies over there, one making statements and asking a question, and the second lady just responding factually?
I want you to imagine that second lady responding with the word "Stop", and using her arms to stop the smaller lady.
Imagine the more powerful, taller lady bringing her hands together underneath the arms of the smaller, submissive lady's arms, raising her hands/arms up between the arms of the smaller lady, and then lifting them up and off, forcing them apart, using the wrists of the dominant lady against the arms of the smaller one.
Can you see that? Good.
Again, regardless of what else happens, know that your intent is to separate that smaller, submissive lady from the dominant, taller one."Okay that is enough," i said at last, reaching up and prying her hands off my bust.
* GOOD *.
This is you throwing off her induction. Good.This small pale woman seemed a little disappointed as she moved out from behind me .
Her creepy gaze rolled over my chest.
<3 more sentences complementing your large chest>
"the buttons are almost threatening to pop free."" she pointed out, stepping right in front of me.
<More touch, going to the buttons of your blouse>
This is another attempt at induction."these buttons are going to pop free."she said as her finger traced the button stand of my blouse. I shyly wrapped my right arm across my chest, so she stopped touching the buttons of my blouse.
First, good -- she is attempting induction, and you respond with a physical barrier. She has to stop. This is good. This is what you should do."Wait a moment, " the small pale woman said , once again stepped forward. "Let me check something."
I just stood there in bewilderment as she pulled my arm away from my breasts. She reached out with her both hands and cupped and squeezed my breasts.
At this point, I think she has you in trance. She's managed to accumulate confusion enough that your resistance has dropped. Notice your next statement:"Is this really necessary?" I asked as she squeezed my boobs , giving them a good feel.
I see two things here. One, you are no longer saying "stop", no longer using a physical barrier. Second, this is the first time you described it as "a good feel". Even the statement/question, "Is this really necessary", is less an objection, and more acceptance.
So making sure that she does not do this to you anymore has to deal with what has already happened.
I want you to realize: You are doing much better this time. You have told her off, at least a little. Next time, your goal, your intention is to prevent her from speaking and touching you.<more communication, and evidence of confusion>
"I m very fond of my personal space. Stop." I protested at last
Again, good.
You are showing that you *can* throw off an unwanted induction. It's not easy, but you can do it.
You *can* throw off an unwanted induction.
Know that it is unwanted.
Know that your intention is to own yourself.
Know what matters to you.
What happens next ... Well, you have another physical shock/surprise, and then you go off to deal with your employees, while she is still doing physical touch.
What happens next ... Well, you are focused on a conversation, while your body is getting an unexpected stimulus. The conversation ends, and you are still getting the stimulus; you are in confusion, and when she stops, all you can do is get out, attempt to remove yourself from that situation, and basically try for a moment of clarify. She follows you, and does more.
The state of trance is basically a state of focused attention, with the key being a change in that focus. And at this point, that's happened.
She is using a combination of touch and conversation. At this point, not only are you in trance, but I'd bet it wasn't even a light trance, and she is only continuing to deepen that trance. We need to focus on stopping this much, much earlier.... I jumped in shock. ... but she kept rubbing and squeezing my ass with her both hands. So i just stood there like paralyzed, ... she finally removed her hands from my ass. ... I was flustered and confused, i needed some fresh air, ... small woman followed me ... started rubbing up and down ...
"You are not arrogant Louisa.
--> You are letting me to touch you. <--
You are a good woman.
-- snip --
Just let me.
-- snip --
I counted about a dozen "positive" statements intended to appeal to you, with those two statements, one at the start, one in the middle.
This is plainly a deepening with two suggestions to permit her.
You are already in trance and being hypnotized. So we need to act earlier to stop this.Also my coat was over my shoulders(balancing a coat on your shoulders isn’t easy. Your shoulders must remain lifted, keeping the luxe fabric from slipping off and down your back.)
Something that I learned a while back is that hypnotizing someone that is physical needs a different technique than someone that is visual. Your statement here makes it seem like you have some (significant?) physical awareness of your body, and how you use it. I'm wondering if this is part of what is happening here -- she is using physical action on you, and as you move, she moves with you.
In fact, reviewing this whole thread, it does look like you are at least somewhat physical, at least somewhat not purely visual.
Reviewing the first post:"...it is buttoned up to the top but the buttons are almost threatening to pop free. " The small pale bookstore clerk said with a great enthusiasm. .
So the same "buttons coming off" was there the first time, along with your comment of emotion. Recall how you felt that time. Recognize it, and see yourself responding to that feeling with "Stop. You are not permitted." Realize that when she has that enthusiasm, you respond by saying, "You are not permitted. Stop now.".
keybounce wrote:First: I see two different things going on here.
I'm going to repeat some questions I asked the last time, rephrased, because I'm not sure you quite followed what I said.
First, repeat: Get Marriage Counseling.
Second: I only have a small look at your life. I only have the little bit you've stated here. This might be wrong. This might be in error.
With that said, it sounds like you are saying that your husband does not let you have friends that he does not know of, and can basically monitor any conversation you have with friends, and you have indicated that you might not be OK with that.
Are you OK with that?
Here, you have someone that wants to be friendly with you, without your husband knowing about it.
Does the idea of having a friend that your husband does not know about appeal to you?
If it does, do you want this woman to be a friend?
This is a serious question. What you do next depends on whether or not you want her to be a friend.
One option is to take action to keep her out of your life.
One option is to take action to have her in your life as a friend who does not manipulate/hypnotize you.
But you have to decide which of those two paths to take.
I will not give you advice until I know which path you advise on.
EDIT: Ok, advice disguised as questions:
1. What do you want, _now_?
2. Who are you when you are not your husband's wife? Who are _you_? Now, today?
3. Who/what really matters to you?
4. What are the _current_ goals in your life? What do you want your _next/new_ goals in your life to be, if your _current_ ones do not match what matters to you?
5. Once you know what you want your new goals to be, what really matters _according to your new goals_?
6. Once you know what really matters, what's next? What do you want to do _new/different_?
What do you want?
What really mattered yesterday?
What really will matter tomorrow?
What will do you to change?
What path do you want?
louisa wrote:Thank you. I am really grateful. I just feel like such a failure. I just feel hopeless. Why do I let this woman walk all over me? This has been eating at me. I feel like a failure. This weirdo woman probably feels like its now "ok" to do because her behavior has been "allowed" by me on two occasions without repercussion. Again I was very confused about the situation. It is just a really new and surprising experience that I've never personally dealt with before. It’s just really awkward and it is not a situation where it is clear what to do. This weird small pale woman is a serial groper, but i don't want to report her to the police because of my husband. I just don't want to involve my husband in this. I just can't talk to my husband about this. I just can't.
keybounce wrote:louisa wrote:Thank you. I am really grateful. I just feel like such a failure. I just feel hopeless. Why do I let this woman walk all over me? This has been eating at me. I feel like a failure. This weirdo woman probably feels like its now "ok" to do because her behavior has been "allowed" by me on two occasions without repercussion. Again I was very confused about the situation. It is just a really new and surprising experience that I've never personally dealt with before. It’s just really awkward and it is not a situation where it is clear what to do. This weird small pale woman is a serial groper, but i don't want to report her to the police because of my husband. I just don't want to involve my husband in this. I just can't talk to my husband about this. I just can't.
I don't think it's a case of "allowing", so much as being surprised. And yes, she will feel it's "ok" unless you do something.
What follows is my advice. It may be wrong, but it's the best advice I can give.
So don't involve your husband. Talk to your employees.
Talk to them about this. Tell them that she isn't allowed to do this.
** Do not wander outside the next time she does this **.
Use your employees as your support group.
If you wander outside, again, with no one else around to help you? She'll do this again.
If you stay inside? And you've made it clear to your employees that (A) She is not allowed to do this, and (B) You want them to speak up to support you when she tries it again?
Having a support group that is there to remind you of what is/is not appropriate when she tries will keep you out of trance / out of her "grope".
Having others to tell her "Stop", will help.
This will help prevent the confusion / uncertainty that she is using to put you under.
But you need to trust, and open up to, your employees.
keybounce wrote:louisa wrote:Thank you. I am really grateful. I just feel like such a failure. I just feel hopeless. Why do I let this woman walk all over me? This has been eating at me. I feel like a failure. This weirdo woman probably feels like its now "ok" to do because her behavior has been "allowed" by me on two occasions without repercussion. Again I was very confused about the situation. It is just a really new and surprising experience that I've never personally dealt with before. It’s just really awkward and it is not a situation where it is clear what to do. This weird small pale woman is a serial groper, but i don't want to report her to the police because of my husband. I just don't want to involve my husband in this. I just can't talk to my husband about this. I just can't.
I don't think it's a case of "allowing", so much as being surprised. And yes, she will feel it's "ok" unless you do something.
What follows is my advice. It may be wrong, but it's the best advice I can give.
So don't involve your husband. Talk to your employees.
Talk to them about this. Tell them that she isn't allowed to do this.
** Do not wander outside the next time she does this **.
Use your employees as your support group.
If you wander outside, again, with no one else around to help you? She'll do this again.
If you stay inside? And you've made it clear to your employees that (A) She is not allowed to do this, and (B) You want them to speak up to support you when she tries it again?
Having a support group that is there to remind you of what is/is not appropriate when she tries will keep you out of trance / out of her "grope".
Having others to tell her "Stop", will help.
This will help prevent the confusion / uncertainty that she is using to put you under.
But you need to trust, and open up to, your employees.
grover27 wrote:I agree with keybounce. Don't let some misapplied embarrassment or shame get in the way of you opening up to your employees about this. Think of a child who gets molested by an adult and thinks it's her fault and doesn't tell anyone. Is it her fault? Should she tell someone? When she does, does anyone judge the child or do they help the child? Open up, don't be ashamed as it's not your fault, tell your employees you don't know how to handle this woman - THEY WILL UNDERSTAND. It's your most effective tool at your disposal for this problem.
louisa wrote:... To be honest my employees don't like me. It's more to do with body language and the tone of voice than anything else, these women my employees haven't actually said anything nasty to my face, but probably are thinking it. I get the feeling that they hate me or at least disapprove of me. They probably think I am arrogant or a snob. Although I'd prefer that they think I'm arrogant to thinking that I'm afraid. I've been asked soooo many times 'why are you so serious' when I'm not feeling serious at that moment. ...
To be honest my employees don't like me.
It's more to do with body language and the tone of voice than anything else
I get the feeling that they hate me or at least disapprove of me.
They probably think I am arrogant or a snob.
(try to be really confident.) I guess other people take that as me being arrogant.
I've been told I come across as stuck up/snobby full of myself, narcissistic, stuck up etc.,
* but the first bit is very untrue. *
I unintentionally tend to give off an unfriendly aura which has led people to ask if I dislike them.
When I feel nervous I try to compensate by being really confident.
(I've been told I come across as) very unwelcoming to new people.
And the truth is, i just can't talk to everyone... not that i don't want to.
I just need time to open myself to people. To relax and open up.
I feel much better when I dress up and present myself as the best I can be.Dressing up makes me feel good because it makes me feel like i can do anything.
Although I'd prefer that they think I'm arrogant to thinking that I'm afraid.
keybounce wrote:louisa wrote:... To be honest my employees don't like me. It's more to do with body language and the tone of voice than anything else, these women my employees haven't actually said anything nasty to my face, but probably are thinking it. I get the feeling that they hate me or at least disapprove of me. They probably think I am arrogant or a snob. Although I'd prefer that they think I'm arrogant to thinking that I'm afraid. I've been asked soooo many times 'why are you so serious' when I'm not feeling serious at that moment. ...
So first, let me restate some of your words:
1a. To be honest, I don't think my employees like me.
1b. To be honest, I don't know if my employees like me.
(One of those is accurate. You tell me which?)
2. I think they hate me or at least disapprove of me, but I'm not willing to double check because _____. Fill in the blank.
3. They clearly do not understand/"get" me, because they don't know my serious/non-serious sides.
What I see here is very simple: You are interacting with them, and assigning views/beliefs to them, and then assuming that what you assigned to them is the truth. And, you even pointed out that they don't get you accurately. Hmm. So it looks like there is no actual communication either way, just "That person's body language is different than mine, so they must be thinking _____".
Solution, to both this mis-communication problem, and to the "How do I use my employees as a support group": *Open up*.
Talk to them. Really, open up, share what you really feel, and take them as friends.
This is NOT without problems. Working with friends has it's own issues. Working with non-friend strangers has issues that you are currently dealing with. Somewhere in the middle (I have never found it myself, but people tell me it exists) is a middle ground where you have some friendship, but still maintain a business relationship. Aim for that. Err on the side of "too friendly" at least for now because you need a support group.
Now, lets look at what you said. I think this is telling.To be honest my employees don't like me.
It's more to do with body language and the tone of voice than anything else
I get the feeling that they hate me or at least disapprove of me.
They probably think I am arrogant or a snob.
(try to be really confident.) I guess other people take that as me being arrogant.
I've been told I come across as stuck up/snobby full of myself, narcissistic, stuck up etc.,
* but the first bit is very untrue. *
Group 1 -- most of this is observations about your impressions of others. They think. I get the feeling. I believe they don't. This is your beliefs.
Note the last bit in here: You have been told X, ** and you discount it**.
You are giving off "stuck up / snobby / full of myself, etc". People have apparently told you this.
*Change*. Talk to people that you want to care about you.I unintentionally tend to give off an unfriendly aura which has led people to ask if I dislike them.
When I feel nervous I try to compensate by being really confident.
(I've been told I come across as) very unwelcoming to new people.
This group is you actually looking at yourself. This is good.And the truth is, i just can't talk to everyone... not that i don't want to.
I just need time to open myself to people. To relax and open up.
I feel much better when I dress up and present myself as the best I can be.Dressing up makes me feel good because it makes me feel like i can do anything.
So ... Oh boy.
You want to talk to others, you want to open up to others. And, you feel that you need time.
Suddenly, here comes a lady that ignores all your body language, treats you like you are already a friend, uses hypnotic techniques to relax you, and is constantly flattering your looks / dressup / telling you that you are presenting yourself as best you can.
She has managed to find and press all your buttons at the same time that she is giving you a brain overload.
---
I don't know the answer here. I think that it's something along the lines of saying that you want to open up to your employees, that you want to dress up for them. So find out. Do they like dressing up? Do you want to have a dress-up party for them?
I actually went over the whole thread. I did not see anything you said about what you sell in your store. Do you, by chance, run a clothing store?
Is your store something where you could have a dress-up party?
Lastly: This line. I kept coming back to this line:Although I'd prefer that they think I'm arrogant to thinking that I'm afraid.
This ... You have to change this.
1. It has to be ok to let those you trust know you are afraid.
2. You have to be willing to trust those you want as your support group.
3. You need your employees as a support group.
I see no way around this. Allow them to know you are afraid, that you are not arrogant, that you need help.
This is on you. And as much as hypnosis can help (it sounds like an almost textbook hypnotherapy situation), I'm not going to recommend hypnosis because your problem is being caused by that.
But I do think that maybe this is the time to talk to a traditional therapist if you can't do it on your own.
grover27 wrote:Louisa,
That is a really weird response from your employee. I assume she is young and slightly free-spirited to have said that. Regardless, she is wrong and you are right in your feelings. You are being molested by this woman and if you don't like it, then it's not right and she needs to stop. It's not harmless and it makes no difference if she is an older small lady or a younger large man. It's another person who is molesting you without your consent. She is objectifying you and while that may be good and fun when a person wants it, it is no good when a person does not want it, like you do not. She is taking advantage of you. I just want you to know that so that you don't start to rationalize that this is okay. I'm glad you talked to someone about it, but sorry that the person you spoke to was not the best set of ears. Keybounce's advice is all very good and I can't give you anymore advice other than to tell you to read it again and take it to heart.
grover27 wrote:Louisa,
That is a really weird response from your employee. I assume she is young and slightly free-spirited to have said that. Regardless, she is wrong and you are right in your feelings. You are being molested by this woman and if you don't like it, then it's not right and she needs to stop. It's not harmless and it makes no difference if she is an older small lady or a younger large man. It's another person who is molesting you without your consent. She is objectifying you and while that may be good and fun when a person wants it, it is no good when a person does not want it, like you do not. She is taking advantage of you. I just want you to know that so that you don't start to rationalize that this is okay. I'm glad you talked to someone about it, but sorry that the person you spoke to was not the best set of ears. Keybounce's advice is all very good and I can't give you anymore advice other than to tell you to read it again and take it to heart.
grover27 wrote:Any updates to your situation Louisa?
keybounce wrote:Bump
Please give us a status update? What has been happening?
keybounce wrote:Bump
Please give us a status update? What has been happening?
grover27 wrote:Louisa,
I don't know if the "why is this happening" to you is so important but I would imagine your co-worker is right about why it is happening. That doesn't make it right and she is wrong. What if you were a magnet for a short weak men? Would that be okay, or is that somehow more wrong? Ignore her nonsense. The question of "why are you letting this happen" may be more relevant but perhaps it doesn't matter so much. You thought the first woman was hypnotizing you somehow. Which is why you came to WMM. Perhaps she isn't hypnotizing you. Although, on WMM there is a lot of hypnosis and attraction toward obedience, compliance and submission. These women are clearly predators that are testing your compliance. They touch you to see what you do. If you say "Ummm, Excuse Me! What are you doing?!" they would probably stop and say something like "Oh, I'm so sorry. You are just so beautiful. I couldn't help myself." At which time, you have to say "well, don't do it again. I generally don't like being molested." That would end it. If they try again, which they likely won't, you can then walk away. If they follow you, you say "No" or "Get away." That would be a normal reaction, even if it seems aggressive. However, you are tested and you acquiesce and comply. Boom. You are now claimed territory to these predator women who feel like you are giving them a free pass - maybe even welcoming it. Perhaps they see you as a sexual creature that invites all forms of fondling and pleasure. Who knows.
So how do you fix it. You need to practice and train. Out loud. In a mirror. Several times a day (in private). imagine the situation has occurred and then walk through the situation: "Ummm, Excuse Me! What are you doing?!" Imagine they say something like "Oh, I'm so sorry. You are just so beautiful. I couldn't help myself." At which time, you say "well, don't do it again. I generally don't like being molested." Practice it several times a day for a week. Then go to work early in the morning and be armed and ready to take on your original groper. You can do this!!
grover27 wrote:Louisa,
First, it's not all your fault. There is no fault here other than these women trying to molest you.
Second, I have no doubt that it would leave you extremely irritable and stressed out. That's why you need to take control over the situation and feel like you have taken back power.
I don't think it is possible that you are under some kind of a spell. I think there is purely a psychological reason for this. Your story reminds me of a time I was in a shopping mall and was stopped by a cart saleswoman. I didn't want what she was buying but she stopped me, complimented me and every time I tried to say no, she resold me. In the end, I ended up buying something I didn't want for more than it was worth. Many years later, I still get mad about that situation. This is really the same for you. You are getting stopped by women who are selling you something you don't want (to be groped). Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. You don't need to be fooled again, but as I said, you need to train and prepare yourself to take back control.
Your comment: "My lack of familiarity with this type of situations was not just limited to being groped either, as so far i had no involvement with lesbians at all." is telling. You were unfamiliar with this situation, which is why you didn't know how to handle it. However, you are now familiar with it and you do know how to handle it. I told you in my last post. Now you just need to prepare yourself.
I think the fact that this has happened to you twice is just a really strange coincidence and not a curse or a vibe you are giving off. But, again, you need to mentally prepare yourself for how to handle the same situation in the future - whether it happens with a woman or a man. You will always be a curvy attractive woman so the reality is that the odds of this happening to you versus someone else are just much higher. There is something appealing about curvy women. I love them too, but I have enough impulse control to not go and grope a random woman. These awkward women clearly don't have impulse control. You need to correct them - it's your body and your right to say who can and cannot touch you.
grover27 wrote:I'm glad to hear that Louisa. Letting go of control and feeling submissive can be fun, but only when you want to. To have someone take advantage of you when you don't want it, is the worst feeling in the world. I don't want you feeling that way. I know you can take control of this situation, and yes I fully believe in you.
grover27 wrote:Louisa, I'm really proud of you. What you did at the end of your story by confronting and firing your shitty employee was perfect. That is exactly what you needed to do and you did it. That was amazing! Fuck her and everything she said to you for sure. Wow, I can't believe she even said that shit. I'm also happy to hear that you were much more assertive this time against Erin, even if you may feel like you still let her touch you more than you want. I would recommend you talk to your business partner about this. You need a woman who can listen to you and respect your views on this. Moreover, you partner can help you in the future to make sure that Erin doesn't touch you again. Tell her that you hear what she is saying but that you don't want to be molested and you can't let it happen again and you need her help to stop it. Even if this is a lie, tell her you were molested when you were younger and that being touched like that fucks with your head. Even the most woke pieces of shit will have to respect that.
I believe I recommended this before I will do so again, https://www.amazon.com/When-Say-No-Feel-Guilty/
grover27 wrote:Louisa, I'm really proud of you. What you did at the end of your story by confronting and firing your shitty employee was perfect. That is exactly what you needed to do and you did it. That was amazing! Fuck her and everything she said to you for sure. Wow, I can't believe she even said that shit. I'm also happy to hear that you were much more assertive this time against Erin, even if you may feel like you still let her touch you more than you want. I would recommend you talk to your business partner about this. You need a woman who can listen to you and respect your views on this. Moreover, you partner can help you in the future to make sure that Erin doesn't touch you again. Tell her that you hear what she is saying but that you don't want to be molested and you can't let it happen again and you need her help to stop it. Even if this is a lie, tell her you were molested when you were younger and that being touched like that fucks with your head. Even the most woke pieces of shit will have to respect that.
I believe I recommended this before I will do so again, https://www.amazon.com/When-Say-No-Feel-Guilty/
grover27 wrote:Louisa, I'm really proud of you. What you did at the end of your story by confronting and firing your shitty employee was perfect. That is exactly what you needed to do and you did it. That was amazing! Fuck her and everything she said to you for sure. Wow, I can't believe she even said that shit. I'm also happy to hear that you were much more assertive this time against Erin, even if you may feel like you still let her touch you more than you want. I would recommend you talk to your business partner about this. You need a woman who can listen to you and respect your views on this. Moreover, you partner can help you in the future to make sure that Erin doesn't touch you again. Tell her that you hear what she is saying but that you don't want to be molested and you can't let it happen again and you need her help to stop it. Even if this is a lie, tell her you were molested when you were younger and that being touched like that fucks with your head. Even the most woke pieces of shit will have to respect that.
I believe I recommended this before I will do so again, https://www.amazon.com/When-Say-No-Feel-Guilty/
grover27 wrote:Louisa, I'm really proud of you. What you did at the end of your story by confronting and firing your shitty employee was perfect. That is exactly what you needed to do and you did it. That was amazing! Fuck her and everything she said to you for sure. Wow, I can't believe she even said that shit. I'm also happy to hear that you were much more assertive this time against Erin, even if you may feel like you still let her touch you more than you want. I would recommend you talk to your business partner about this. You need a woman who can listen to you and respect your views on this. Moreover, you partner can help you in the future to make sure that Erin doesn't touch you again. Tell her that you hear what she is saying but that you don't want to be molested and you can't let it happen again and you need her help to stop it. Even if this is a lie, tell her you were molested when you were younger and that being touched like that fucks with your head. Even the most woke pieces of shit will have to respect that.
I believe I recommended this before I will do so again, https://www.amazon.com/When-Say-No-Feel-Guilty/
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